DTT vs. Goerend
09-02-2005, 09:23 AM
#31
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BB:
I think people have mentioned that both are good trans. Also as mentioned I have heard complaints about both. Both give good customer service. So I will just give you my experience with my choice which was DTT.
After speaking with Bill at DTT and telling him the who, what ,when, where and how I use my truck he gave me his recommendation of what he would do. He mentioned that I was on the line for one or two parts for my use. Said you could use them but not a necessity since I was sort of on the line. Not a sales push at all on those other parts. Well I bit the bullet and headed up to his shop from Denver. Made a nice vacation out of it. What a difference. Vinney and Darren up there in his shop had my truck in at 9am and I drove away at 1pm after we had lunch there.
Fast forward 4 months. On vacation in NE Arizona at Canyon De Chelly. It is about as BFE as you can get on the Navajo reservation. There are a couple of towns not far but no shops of any kind. Anyway at a gas station filling up on my way back to camp to get ready to head to the Grand Canyon the next morning. I notice a puddle under the truck but pay it no mind as I just used about 2 gals of water cleaning the windshield. I stop at the park visitor center for the wife for a second as I walk back to the truck I again notice a puddle. Crawl under there this time and sure enough tranny fluid. Head to camp and break out the tools. It is leaking from the inspection plate. I am hoping that the tc plug has worked loose but no it is tight and appears to be leaking from up in there somewhere. No cell reception out there so I head to the closest phone about 20 miles away. It is tuesday 6pm. I call the shop and get Bill (suprised that they are still there). He tells me to check this and that and try this and that. After no avail he tells me I am screwed and need to get to a shop asap. By now it is 8pm, he has been hanging around waiting for me to call him back after each procedure. He asks me where I am at, tell him he looks on his map ands say boy oh boy you are out in BFE and really are screwed. My comment is YEAH I KNOW THAT ALREADY. I am sweating bullets at this point. He tells me where the closest installers are Phoenix 300 miles and ALBQ 200 miles. He gives me the phone numbers to call them. I am thinking there is no way a shop is still going to be open at 8pm. One no answer I leave a vm. I call the other. An answer thank god. It is his home phone number. I talk to him and he says if you can get it here I can fix it. I call Bill back and tell him where I am headed. He tells me to call him when I get there and the best way to get the trans to make it there (by the way I am pulling a trailer). Get there the next day (wednesday) about 1pm. I was supposed to load up on any trans fluid I could fine and just replenish it as the level dropped. So I would stop and check the fluid level every thirty minutes. To my surprise after the first stop/check it quit leaking.
Went to ALBQ, wife has family there so dropped off the trailer and while backing it in the spot the trans gets fairly toasty. Make it to the shop with ever higher trans temps. Low and behold what do I find at the address is a freaking Dodge Dealer. I am now at least safe in town but at a dodge dealer. I warily go in ask for the guy and he comes right out says bring the truck into the service bay. Truck won't move for about 2 minutes. Get it in he puts it up on the rack does his inspection and tells me what he thinks is wrong. Then he tells me that Bill had already called him first thing in the morning and told him that he was overnighting the parts (I had called Bill when I got to town, he didnt mention this). Installer says parts are covered by Bill but his dealership labor was not. No choice just fix it. He tells me the parts should be here tommorrow. Either in the morning truck or the afternoon not sure which. If on the morn truck would be ready thursday night if afternoon truck be ready friday afternoon. Well at this point it is being taken care of but my vacation is pretty much trashed. I talk with the wife and say the heck with it. Rented a car and drove down to Carlsbad Caverns on thursday am. Called the installer thursday from the road about 4pm. He says if I wasn't on the phone talking to you I would be done, just getting ready to take it for a test drive. I call back in 30 minutes he says come get it, shes done. I tell him I wont be back until friday night. No problem just come then. Well we dont get back until too late so I have to wait until saturday morning to pick it up. There she sits looking good. I pay my labor bill (900.00) and drive off all is well. Head back to Denver on Sunday with no problems.
Talking with the installer on Thursday pm he tells me what he found. The front bushing had worked loose putting pressure on the front seal causing the leak. After a while it had worked its way underneath the front seal lip and stopped the leak. However trans pressure was very low which was caused by the front pump going out due to the leak. He replaced the entire front half of the trans- tc, pump, input shaft and hub etc etc. The overnight freight bill was 450.00 alone. Not to mention another 2k+ in parts. All was covered except the labor.
I was so impressed with the speed, thoroughness and apparent quality of service that I hunted down the Dealership owner when I picked up the truck. When he approached me I could see in his face that he was ready for a royal butt chewing from an angry customer. He was very surprised to hear the glowing words of praise I had for his installer. Who he said was one of their best and showed me all his certifications and awards framed on the wall in the dealership.
Monday morning I call Bill to let him know what is up. His wife Shanti answered the phone. The very first thing out of her mouth was what is your credit card number. I sheepishly ask why half expecting to need to go into *** mode. So that I can credit you the labor you had to pay, how much was it she says. I tell her, then she starts to ream me out a bit for not calling sooner. Said the original installer Vinney, had called her at home on sat and sun wanting word of how it was going. Bill then got on the phone said it was all covered and he hoped it all worked out ok etc etc. We chit chatted a bit about his certified installers and that they must not only meet the technical criteria he has set out there for them but also they must meet his personal character criteria like willing to take phone calls at home at night etc. Said the failure I had was fairly uncommon for the 47re and he had seen very few like that.
Anyway there is no way he could have gotten it taken care of any quicker or any better than what happened. Truck fixed in just over 24 hours with the parts shipped from Canada to ALBQ and no charge for any of it. Is this how he treats everyone? Not sure, but previous to my trans work from him he didnt know me from Adam so I would think it must be normal for them to go the extra mile. I obviously was not thrilled to find my new expensive trans with only 10k on it failing in BFE but he certainly stood behind his product 100% and then some. DTT has earned as much of my business as they can provide. Does Goerends have the same quality products and service, quite possibly but I have no personal experience with them though.
I think people have mentioned that both are good trans. Also as mentioned I have heard complaints about both. Both give good customer service. So I will just give you my experience with my choice which was DTT.
After speaking with Bill at DTT and telling him the who, what ,when, where and how I use my truck he gave me his recommendation of what he would do. He mentioned that I was on the line for one or two parts for my use. Said you could use them but not a necessity since I was sort of on the line. Not a sales push at all on those other parts. Well I bit the bullet and headed up to his shop from Denver. Made a nice vacation out of it. What a difference. Vinney and Darren up there in his shop had my truck in at 9am and I drove away at 1pm after we had lunch there.
Fast forward 4 months. On vacation in NE Arizona at Canyon De Chelly. It is about as BFE as you can get on the Navajo reservation. There are a couple of towns not far but no shops of any kind. Anyway at a gas station filling up on my way back to camp to get ready to head to the Grand Canyon the next morning. I notice a puddle under the truck but pay it no mind as I just used about 2 gals of water cleaning the windshield. I stop at the park visitor center for the wife for a second as I walk back to the truck I again notice a puddle. Crawl under there this time and sure enough tranny fluid. Head to camp and break out the tools. It is leaking from the inspection plate. I am hoping that the tc plug has worked loose but no it is tight and appears to be leaking from up in there somewhere. No cell reception out there so I head to the closest phone about 20 miles away. It is tuesday 6pm. I call the shop and get Bill (suprised that they are still there). He tells me to check this and that and try this and that. After no avail he tells me I am screwed and need to get to a shop asap. By now it is 8pm, he has been hanging around waiting for me to call him back after each procedure. He asks me where I am at, tell him he looks on his map ands say boy oh boy you are out in BFE and really are screwed. My comment is YEAH I KNOW THAT ALREADY. I am sweating bullets at this point. He tells me where the closest installers are Phoenix 300 miles and ALBQ 200 miles. He gives me the phone numbers to call them. I am thinking there is no way a shop is still going to be open at 8pm. One no answer I leave a vm. I call the other. An answer thank god. It is his home phone number. I talk to him and he says if you can get it here I can fix it. I call Bill back and tell him where I am headed. He tells me to call him when I get there and the best way to get the trans to make it there (by the way I am pulling a trailer). Get there the next day (wednesday) about 1pm. I was supposed to load up on any trans fluid I could fine and just replenish it as the level dropped. So I would stop and check the fluid level every thirty minutes. To my surprise after the first stop/check it quit leaking.
Went to ALBQ, wife has family there so dropped off the trailer and while backing it in the spot the trans gets fairly toasty. Make it to the shop with ever higher trans temps. Low and behold what do I find at the address is a freaking Dodge Dealer. I am now at least safe in town but at a dodge dealer. I warily go in ask for the guy and he comes right out says bring the truck into the service bay. Truck won't move for about 2 minutes. Get it in he puts it up on the rack does his inspection and tells me what he thinks is wrong. Then he tells me that Bill had already called him first thing in the morning and told him that he was overnighting the parts (I had called Bill when I got to town, he didnt mention this). Installer says parts are covered by Bill but his dealership labor was not. No choice just fix it. He tells me the parts should be here tommorrow. Either in the morning truck or the afternoon not sure which. If on the morn truck would be ready thursday night if afternoon truck be ready friday afternoon. Well at this point it is being taken care of but my vacation is pretty much trashed. I talk with the wife and say the heck with it. Rented a car and drove down to Carlsbad Caverns on thursday am. Called the installer thursday from the road about 4pm. He says if I wasn't on the phone talking to you I would be done, just getting ready to take it for a test drive. I call back in 30 minutes he says come get it, shes done. I tell him I wont be back until friday night. No problem just come then. Well we dont get back until too late so I have to wait until saturday morning to pick it up. There she sits looking good. I pay my labor bill (900.00) and drive off all is well. Head back to Denver on Sunday with no problems.
Talking with the installer on Thursday pm he tells me what he found. The front bushing had worked loose putting pressure on the front seal causing the leak. After a while it had worked its way underneath the front seal lip and stopped the leak. However trans pressure was very low which was caused by the front pump going out due to the leak. He replaced the entire front half of the trans- tc, pump, input shaft and hub etc etc. The overnight freight bill was 450.00 alone. Not to mention another 2k+ in parts. All was covered except the labor.
I was so impressed with the speed, thoroughness and apparent quality of service that I hunted down the Dealership owner when I picked up the truck. When he approached me I could see in his face that he was ready for a royal butt chewing from an angry customer. He was very surprised to hear the glowing words of praise I had for his installer. Who he said was one of their best and showed me all his certifications and awards framed on the wall in the dealership.
Monday morning I call Bill to let him know what is up. His wife Shanti answered the phone. The very first thing out of her mouth was what is your credit card number. I sheepishly ask why half expecting to need to go into *** mode. So that I can credit you the labor you had to pay, how much was it she says. I tell her, then she starts to ream me out a bit for not calling sooner. Said the original installer Vinney, had called her at home on sat and sun wanting word of how it was going. Bill then got on the phone said it was all covered and he hoped it all worked out ok etc etc. We chit chatted a bit about his certified installers and that they must not only meet the technical criteria he has set out there for them but also they must meet his personal character criteria like willing to take phone calls at home at night etc. Said the failure I had was fairly uncommon for the 47re and he had seen very few like that.
Anyway there is no way he could have gotten it taken care of any quicker or any better than what happened. Truck fixed in just over 24 hours with the parts shipped from Canada to ALBQ and no charge for any of it. Is this how he treats everyone? Not sure, but previous to my trans work from him he didnt know me from Adam so I would think it must be normal for them to go the extra mile. I obviously was not thrilled to find my new expensive trans with only 10k on it failing in BFE but he certainly stood behind his product 100% and then some. DTT has earned as much of my business as they can provide. Does Goerends have the same quality products and service, quite possibly but I have no personal experience with them though.
09-02-2005, 09:45 AM
#32
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Originally Posted by Cowhand
Both know the 47R trans inside, outside, and upside down. All that's left then is cost.
BarryG - Great story.
RJ
09-02-2005, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by rjohnson
And expirience with higher hp trucks!
BarryG - Great story.
RJ
BarryG - Great story.
RJ
I guess Dave should be flattered to even be mentioned in the same breath with Bill
I have one of those warm fuzzy stories too...https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...hlight=goerend
09-02-2005, 04:30 PM
#38
Registered User
Sorry if it came across as a slam....IYO. I was trying to add something to what I thought was over simplified by your saying... all else was equal so only cost needed to be considered.
I am aware that Goerand Bros had some trouble in the not to distant past with higher HP trucks. I know they stood behind their problems and made it right...but they have had growing pains.
DTT had the same learning curve 7-8 years ago and HAS solved the problems. What I don't know is if Dave has solved the formula for bigger hp or not? I'm not saying I think he hasn't....I'm saying I don't know?
Since Big Blue has stated his goal is 600 hp someday...this seemed worth bringing up.
RJ
I am aware that Goerand Bros had some trouble in the not to distant past with higher HP trucks. I know they stood behind their problems and made it right...but they have had growing pains.
DTT had the same learning curve 7-8 years ago and HAS solved the problems. What I don't know is if Dave has solved the formula for bigger hp or not? I'm not saying I think he hasn't....I'm saying I don't know?
Since Big Blue has stated his goal is 600 hp someday...this seemed worth bringing up.
RJ
09-02-2005, 05:42 PM
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Sorry RJ, next time I'll draw a little slower
Didn't mean to lump you in with the "rabid" Wolf Pack. Seen too many of these go south....I follow ya, Dave probably hasn't had much call to support that kind of HP til recently, he started out working on anything that fit in the door and in the last couple years really started concentrating on Dodge transmissions.
I think apples to apples, Goerend and DTT compare favorably up to around 500-550. DTT definitely has more high HP trucks under their belt, but I'll bet Dave has just about got it figured out if he hasn't done so already.
But like I said, Dave should be flattered to even be mentioned in the same breath with DTT, and no sarcasm this time
09-02-2005, 10:12 PM
#40
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Well I talked to Goerend today and I talked to DTT the other day.
I called dave about 1 this afternoon and he called me back at 6 tonight. No big deal since I was still working. I asked him a bunch of questions as to what he recommends, what kind of material his clutches are made of, the planetary's, what shafts to get, his warranty, his prices, everything. Not only did he answer everyone of my questions with enthusiasm but he also went into great detail about each one and why he recommended it and the pressures he puts on the VB at idle and WOT and how the tranny works. It was really awesome. His prices are also really awesome. If you want to know what he quoted me then PM me. I also told him that I planned on going over 600hp someday and asked him how his tranny's are holding and he was very honest with me. He says he does have a few trucks that are pushing that kind of power but they have only had them in there for about 6-8 months. He said time will tell but if something breaks then it's all a learning curve for him. "He is in a school of hardknocks and he has to pay his tuition somehow" is what he told me. That right there says something about his character. A man who's not afraid to admit that his part can and sometimes does break and that right there means a lot to me.
I talked to stephan I believe it was (it was a couple of days ago) and while he did answer all of my questions, he didn't seem to be quite as enthused (sp) about it as Dave was and he didn't go into as much detail as to how they set it up and everything. He was still a really nice guy.
So after all of that I'm still undecided on who I want. Dave certaintly has their price and warranty beat and he's a heckuva a guy to boot to call me back near or at closing time and BS with me for half an hour.
I called dave about 1 this afternoon and he called me back at 6 tonight. No big deal since I was still working. I asked him a bunch of questions as to what he recommends, what kind of material his clutches are made of, the planetary's, what shafts to get, his warranty, his prices, everything. Not only did he answer everyone of my questions with enthusiasm but he also went into great detail about each one and why he recommended it and the pressures he puts on the VB at idle and WOT and how the tranny works. It was really awesome. His prices are also really awesome. If you want to know what he quoted me then PM me. I also told him that I planned on going over 600hp someday and asked him how his tranny's are holding and he was very honest with me. He says he does have a few trucks that are pushing that kind of power but they have only had them in there for about 6-8 months. He said time will tell but if something breaks then it's all a learning curve for him. "He is in a school of hardknocks and he has to pay his tuition somehow" is what he told me. That right there says something about his character. A man who's not afraid to admit that his part can and sometimes does break and that right there means a lot to me.
I talked to stephan I believe it was (it was a couple of days ago) and while he did answer all of my questions, he didn't seem to be quite as enthused (sp) about it as Dave was and he didn't go into as much detail as to how they set it up and everything. He was still a really nice guy.
So after all of that I'm still undecided on who I want. Dave certaintly has their price and warranty beat and he's a heckuva a guy to boot to call me back near or at closing time and BS with me for half an hour.
09-03-2005, 07:42 AM
#41
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I can only tell you about my experiance with DTT
I have had a DTT trans in my truck for 3 years,Its a daily driver,It sees the dragstrip often,It also pushes snow.
09-03-2005, 10:58 AM
#42
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transmission
I have ridden in some DTT enhanced or rebuilt transmission and they top notch, at least the shifting, ect. Each truck had different hp. At the time I thought when I get my truck in lockup in 3 gear i cant tell any difference. But getting to 3 gear lock WAS...
My friend had a 99 quad cab 4x4 automatic and it quit shifting , and he asked for help so I gave him Dave work number. Dave called him at home and stepped him through the how to check process. Gave him the part number and even gave Harvey his home number. Harvey asked him how much he owed and Dave said nothing. Harvey truck shifts great now. Dave telephone bill must be huge...
Harvey said I put Daves number in his telephone book as a shop in
town wont 1750$ to fix it. Harvey said Dave was as great guy.... I also have talked to DTT and they are also . Glad there is a choice. Jim
My friend had a 99 quad cab 4x4 automatic and it quit shifting , and he asked for help so I gave him Dave work number. Dave called him at home and stepped him through the how to check process. Gave him the part number and even gave Harvey his home number. Harvey asked him how much he owed and Dave said nothing. Harvey truck shifts great now. Dave telephone bill must be huge...
Harvey said I put Daves number in his telephone book as a shop in
town wont 1750$ to fix it. Harvey said Dave was as great guy.... I also have talked to DTT and they are also . Glad there is a choice. Jim
09-03-2005, 11:22 AM
#43
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blue,,,,,when talking to both,ask specifics.....make sure you are talking apples to apples.im telling you that you are not..im not gonna bash anybodys products,as cowhand said,anybodys can and will break....but back to the point,dont price a dtt ,full updated internal tranny against a straight rebuild of daves.if you want that price,ask dtt about a stock rebuild with just an updated vb and con in it...unless things have changed ,dave only increases number of clutches on 47rh`s,not re`s.he also doesnt have billet servos,pistons and acc.....the last i knew the only billet part he had was a second gear apply lever and shafts .whether or not you need all these things is another question altogether,,,,but just be sure to find out exactly what is being upgraded and whats not,thats going to be your difference in pricing................bama
09-03-2005, 05:38 PM
#44
Registered User
Well I think that even if we assume everything inside the tranny itself of identic quality for the moment one big difference will remain- the characteristics of the torque converter. (not the lockup clutch this one is simple)
I think the TC caracteristics will play a major role in hte driveability- not only stall point but also torque multiplication over rpm range and stuff like that- this has to cooperate with the characteristics of the turbo, low boost fueling, injectors etc. So therefore brand X may be the right one for me while brand y will be better for someone else. Somehow it's like choosing shoes. Got to fit, if not all the quality is for nothing.
Just my 2c
AlpineRAM
I think the TC caracteristics will play a major role in hte driveability- not only stall point but also torque multiplication over rpm range and stuff like that- this has to cooperate with the characteristics of the turbo, low boost fueling, injectors etc. So therefore brand X may be the right one for me while brand y will be better for someone else. Somehow it's like choosing shoes. Got to fit, if not all the quality is for nothing.
Just my 2c
AlpineRAM
09-03-2005, 08:23 PM
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converter
I think the TC caracteristics will play a major role in hte driveability- not only stall point but also torque multiplication over rpm range and stuff like that- this has to cooperate with the characteristics of the turbo, low boost fueling, injectors etc. So therefore brand X may be the right one for me while brand y will be better for someone else. Somehow it's like choosing shoes. Got to fit, if not all the quality is for nothing.
Just my 2c That is a great idea. I think that Dave has a converter, that from what I have been told is very good, by several folks that have them, No it is not a milled stator.
I like the 89h but I really wonted it in a tripple lock, though I have been told several times it is not required. If I just had to have a 89h with a tripple lock I know where to get it. Any way the stator that Dave make is good too and I would use it also. It is good to have choices. Jim
Just my 2c That is a great idea. I think that Dave has a converter, that from what I have been told is very good, by several folks that have them, No it is not a milled stator.
I like the 89h but I really wonted it in a tripple lock, though I have been told several times it is not required. If I just had to have a 89h with a tripple lock I know where to get it. Any way the stator that Dave make is good too and I would use it also. It is good to have choices. Jim