|
93 radiator and electric fans in a 90?
Hey everyone.
so yesterday I found that my rad is leaking by the lower hose. I was doing some thinking and was wondering if its worth swapping in a 93 crossflow rad. The truck is a 90 non intercooled 5 speed. Im going to put a second gen intercooler in it which I have all the parts for already. My main questions are how much work is it to put a 93 rad in and what fans should I put in? I dont tow with the truck and its a daily driver. I was going to hook up the fans to a temp switch. Also gonna delete my ac and my mechanical fan. I found the belt and the sioner pulley to delete everything already. I also have a 93 thermostat housing already. So really all I need is the fans, fan controller, 93 rad, and 93 upper hose. But like I said I dont know what fans will fit or how much work it is to swap a 93 radio in. Any input is much appreciated! |
Never done it, but I am pretty sure you need the Intercooled radiator support....... I would say unless you needed the additional cooling it isn't worth it.
|
Originally Posted by patdaly
(Post 3345039)
Never done it, but I am pretty sure you need the Intercooled radiator support....... I would say unless you needed the additional cooling it isn't worth it.
better design and more efficient. Im just not sure on fan dimensions or cfm |
I tried electric fans on my truck and found them useless and did not cool worth a darn. If the temps were anywhere over 20*C they had a very very hard time keeping up with the cooling, and that was just running around town, no hwy or pulling, AC etc.
The problem with electric fans on the cummins motor is there is no fan that can generate the same CFM that the OEM fan/clutch assembly can. Waste of time and money IMO. As for fitting the IC rad in a NON-IC rad support.....never done it that way so can't say....but you'll need the upper and lower mounts. The uppers are easy since they bolt on, but the lower mounts are welded to the core support so might be tougher to find. |
Originally Posted by thrashingcows
(Post 3345058)
I tried electric fans on my truck and found them useless and did not cool worth a darn. If the temps were anywhere over 20*C they had a very very hard time keeping up with the cooling, and that was just running around town, no hwy or pulling, AC etc.
The problem with electric fans on the cummins motor is there is no fan that can generate the same CFM that the OEM fan/clutch assembly can. Waste of time and money IMO. As for fitting the IC rad in a NON-IC rad support.....never done it that way so can't say....but you'll need the upper and lower mounts. The uppers are easy since they bolt on, but the lower mounts are welded to the core support so might be tougher to find. |
I have never heard a guy with a 12V tell me he liked his electric fan swap after he did it.
They all tell me it will not cool enough. |
Originally Posted by Gizmo52
(Post 3345080)
every link I've read said they love their electric fans and have had no issues with them. Im gonna get a 180 thermostat and with the new cross flow rad its gonna cool better than my original rad. But I don't think my mechanical fan is going to fit after the radio swap so the electric fans should fit hopfully I just dont know how but to go on fans or cfm needed.
I can tell you that no aftermarket fan, regardless of what they say the rated CFM is will move as much air as some OEM fans do and certainly not as much as the stock mechanical fan does. |
Originally Posted by Gizmo52
(Post 3345080)
But I don't think my mechanical fan is going to fit after the radio swap so the electric fans should fit hopfully I just dont know how but to go on fans or cfm needed.
Is that the new short hand for radiator? |
Originally Posted by oliver foster
(Post 3345084)
What does swapping the RADIO out have to do with room for the fans?
Is that the new short hand for radiator? |
Originally Posted by Angry Johnny
(Post 3345083)
Well what did the people use for fans in the links you read?
I can tell you that no aftermarket fan, regardless of what they say the rated CFM is will move as much air as some OEM fans do and certainly not as much as the stock mechanical fan does. |
Originally Posted by Gizmo52
(Post 3345089)
thats the think... Some people use ford Taurus fans other use Lincoln fans and some just purple in 2 12" or 14 inch flexalite fans. But they all flow different cfm. Honestly if I can find 2 12" fans that flow 3000 cfm I think it should be plenty
|
Originally Posted by Gizmo52
(Post 3345089)
thats the think... Some people use ford Taurus fans other use Lincoln fans and some just purple in 2 12" or 14 inch flexalite fans. But they all flow different cfm. Honestly if I can find 2 12" fans that flow 3000 cfm I think it should be plenty
|
Originally Posted by thrashingcows
(Post 3345102)
That was what I was running...2- 12" fans and as I mentioned above they just don't cut it. Perhaps the threads where the people "love 'em" is just the initial time after install, I ran mine for 6-9 months and the first month or so seemed ok, but after that did not care for them a bit.
|
Why do people ask questions, then when they don't get the answer they want...fight it? It is not like A.J. and Thrashing, don't know their 1st gen stuff.
What is the difference between over heating and just getting warm? Both options you can't drive your truck like you want to. Last I checked you where building some hot rod style truck that is sure to build extra heat over a stock truck. Flex a Lite makes a $600 twin electric fan for 2nd gen Cummins trucks that comes mounted in it's own fan shroud. It is listed that it will NOT work on rigs that TOW in writing right on the add. I bet that means it can't keep tuned up trucks cool enough either. If a $600 CUSTOM built fan set up will not work,on a even bigger 2nd gen radiator, some rigged up couple of fans on a '93 radiator is less than likely to work. Check out Flex A Lite's web site for the CFM and sizes they use, if you just have to do this mod. If I was to do a '93 radiator swap on a '90 I would use all the factory parts and do it right the first time. |
Originally Posted by oliver foster
(Post 3345140)
Why do people ask questions, then when they don't get the answer they want...fight it? It is not like A.J. and Thrashing, don't know their 1st gen stuff.
What is the difference between over heating and just getting warm? Both options you can't drive your truck like you want to. Last I checked you where building some hot rod style truck that is sure to build extra heat over a stock truck. Flex a Lite makes a $600 twin electric fan for 2nd gen Cummins trucks that comes mounted in it's own fan shroud. It is listed that it will NOT work on rigs that TOW in writing right on the add. I bet that means it can't keep tuned up trucks cool enough either. If a $600 CUSTOM built fan set up will not work,on a even bigger 2nd gen radiator, some rigged up couple of fans on a '93 radiator is less than likely to work. Check out Flex A Lite's web site for the CFM and sizes they use, if you just have to do this mod. If I was to do a '93 radiator swap on a '90 I would use all the factory parts and do it right the first time. |
Originally Posted by Gizmo52
(Post 3345141)
Look dude, I dont know who ****** in your corn flakes but I'm just trying to get information. In no way am I fighting or arguing because im "not getting the answer I'm looking for." Im simply asking about people experiences they've had with as much info as I can get. Which is exactly what the point of a forum is. There is a big difference between getting warm and overheating. And if you read my first post its a daily driver that never tows. It its tuned up and the coolent temps do raise a little after a pull but I've never had a problem with it overheating, with that said I've seen the flexalite setup but I want information on what other people have done.
Hey Gizmo. no one is peeing in your cheerio's either. They're telling you, that from experience, there are several guys on here with more than decades of working with these trucks, who have attempted the project you're going after. They're trying to tell you that the expense you're taking on, and the results you're looking to achieve are most likely "in vain". Most of the guys on this forum who post daily, are here to HELP others with their rides. They don't get paid, they don't troll to start trouble, and best of all, they're all passionate about these particular genre of Mopar vehicles. Ollie is a freaking encyclopedia of information when it comes to interchanging, swaps, upgrades from gassers, and you name it, as long as it falls under the title of 1st and 2nd Gen dodge cummins trucks. He's owned more 1st and 2nd gen dodges than anyone in the country, and has enough parts on the shelves to build 50 or more complete trucks. The dude can't tie his own shoelaces, but he's done more conversions than anyone I know, and has more knowledge of the specifications of these rides, than anyone I know. Good to have as a friend, eh ? So, you can take the info provided, and do what you want with it. No one is trying to tell you what to do. They're telling you that you're in all probability, not going to be happy with it, and attempting to spare you the headache's they've already lived. Let us know how your project all works out. |
Originally Posted by Gizmo52
(Post 3345141)
Look dude, I dont know who ****** in your corn flakes but I'm just trying to get information. In no way am I fighting or arguing because im "not getting the answer I'm looking for." Im simply asking about people experiences they've had with as much info as I can get. Which is exactly what the point of a forum is. There is a big difference between getting warm and overheating. And if you read my first post its a daily driver that never tows. It its tuned up and the coolent temps do raise a little after a pull but I've never had a problem with it overheating, with that said I've seen the flexalite setup but I want information on what other people have done.
Since the core support is still in the same relative position to the engine I don't see why the mechanical fan wouldn't fit. All the extra room needed for the intercooler and such on the 91.5 to 93's was achieved from the core support out to the grille. |
I am just trying to help you out on your project. I would think the info. I [and other] have given you should save you a bunch of time and money. Do what you like with it.
Let me know how it works out for you, if you do try it. I am off to work on my own 12V swap. I can assure you, I will be using the stock fan and shroud on my build. |
1 Attachment(s)
Hey Ollie,
Why do you have a pencil up your nose ???? That's not like you ! [nonono] |
Originally Posted by NJTman
(Post 3345142)
Hey Gizmo.
no one is peeing in your cheerio's either. They're telling you, that from experience, there are several guys on here with more than decades of working with these trucks, who have attempted the project you're going after. They're trying to tell you that the expense you're taking on, and the results you're looking to achieve are most likely "in vain". Most of the guys on this forum who post daily, are here to HELP others with their rides. They don't get paid, they don't troll to start trouble, and best of all, they're all passionate about these particular genre of Mopar vehicles. Ollie is a freaking encyclopedia of information when it comes to interchanging, swaps, upgrades from gassers, and you name it, as long as it falls under the title of 1st and 2nd Gen dodge cummins trucks. He's owned more 1st and 2nd gen dodges than anyone in the country, and has enough parts on the shelves to build 50 or more complete trucks. The dude can't tie his own shoelaces, but he's done more conversions than anyone I know, and has more knowledge of the specifications of these rides, than anyone I know. Good to have as a friend, eh ? So, you can take the info provided, and do what you want with it. No one is trying to tell you what to do. They're telling you that you're in all probability, not going to be happy with it, and attempting to spare you the headache's they've already lived. Let us know how your project all works out. |
Originally Posted by Angry Johnny
(Post 3345143)
Looks like most other people have/would opt to keep the mechanical fan. Maybe you can be a pioneer here and let us know how it works out.
Since the core support is still in the same relative position to the engine I don't see why the mechanical fan wouldn't fit. All the extra room needed for the intercooler and such on the 91.5 to 93's was achieved from the core support out to the grille. |
Originally Posted by oliver foster
(Post 3345144)
I am just trying to help you out on your project. I would think the info. I [and other] have given you should save you a bunch of time and money. Do what you like with it.
Let me know how it works out for you, if you do try it. I am off to work on my own 12V swap. I can assure you, I will be using the stock fan and shroud on my build. |
Originally Posted by Gizmo52
(Post 3345150)
i havent taken any measurements from the OEM rad to fan but I know the IC rad is about 3/4" thicker so I was under the assumption that it wouldnt fit.
|
Originally Posted by Gizmo52
(Post 3345151)
sorry for my reaction before. The beginning of your post just seemed to come off a little snippy. I do appreciate the input. Is there any better mechanical fan clutch or blade to use if I do go mechanical?
I am not saying you can't make the electric fan work. I am just saying that lots and lots of very mechanically inclined people could not get it to work well enough for them in the past. If you don't have an overheating problem now, just a leaky rad.... I would just replace the NON IC'ed radiator with the proper one and be done with it. Otherwise to get the '93 style rad. to fit right using stock parts, you would need to change the: upper rad. neck and hose Fan hub and clutch fan radiator fan shroud core support and grille - unless you wanted to do some extra work to make the parts fit. Which if you doing the 2nd gen I/C swap, you are better off at least installing the later grille as it will give you some extra room to work with. I have done the 2nd gen intercooler swap on my '91.0 and one of my '85 crew cabs and the later grille is the easiest way to make it happen. That seems like a lot to to do unless you really already have an over heating problem. The stock stuff always seems to work well enough for my projects. I am unaware of a better mechanical fan option. |
Originally Posted by oliver foster
(Post 3345155)
No worries, I am just trying to save you some time and money.
I am not saying you can't make the electric fan work. I am just saying that lots and lots of very mechanically inclined people could not get it to work well enough for them in the past. If you don't have an overheating problem now, just a leaky rad.... I would just replace the NON IC'ed radiator with the proper one and be done with it. Otherwise to get the '93 style rad. to fit right using stock parts, you would need to change the: upper rad. neck and hose Fan hub and clutch fan radiator fan shroud core support and grille - unless you wanted to do some extra work to make the parts fit. Which if you doing the 2nd gen I/C swap, you are better off at least installing the later grille as it will give you some extra room to work with. I have done the 2nd gen intercooler swap on my '91.0 and one of my '85 crew cabs and the later grille is the easiest way to make it happen. That seems like a lot to to do unless you really already have an over heating problem. The stock stuff always seems to work well enough for my projects. I am unaware of a better mechanical fan option. im still going to sway the rad as for the fans... Still looking for a set that will work. Ill keep you posted on how it goes. Thanks again for the help |
Hay guys just an update. I swapped the intercooled rad into my non intercooled rad support. Just had to get a intercooled thermostat housing and an intercooled upper hose. Made my own mounts out of 3 inchs angle iron. Fits nice and snug. Also did my mechanical fan delete and ac delete. electric fan installed too. Used a two speed fan from a 96 mark 8 trimmed it up a bit and wired the high speed to come on at 195.
|
:worthless:
Well? Progression requires sharing visual representation for those of us with limited intelligence. [coffee] |
Ok, now that this is all hashed out, I live somewhere between Hades and the caldera of a nearby volcano and the temps approach 1 million degrees farengrade and I have a very similar truck. Mine has never even gotten to half way on the temp gauge and that is with 200% pure antifreeze. I don't know what all the hubbub is about fans, intercoolers and radiators. It seems that it is most often people that live way north of the northpole. I am currently trying to slip bigger tires over my existing tires, like slippers, because I might have a flat tire. Really, my main project now is finding a new air filter grinder, because Tman made me sell my old one :D:D ... Melty Mark
|
Originally Posted by NJTman
(Post 3347529)
:worthless:
Well? Progression requires sharing visual representation for those of us with limited intelligence. https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...7c09a9cdb6.jpg Driver Side Upper Mount (Rad) https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...4cb18df5cc.jpg Passenger Side Upper Mount (Rad) https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...698f141b26.jpg Solenoid/ Controller wiring. (Controller activates solenoid to power fan at 195 https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...15fdc7c65f.jpg Upper Fan Mounts (on Rad) also Routing of belt with AC Delete and Fan Hub Delete https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...21417a6d9c.jpg Lower Rad Mounts and Fan Lower Mounts insert in clips on the Rad https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...ec10bc990a.jpg Lower Fan Mounts https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...e7e34439a6.jpg Water Pump Clearance https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...4975027946.jpg Fan Motor Clearance https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.die...db0ab209de.jpg Tried to get a Crank Clearance shot if there's anything else specific or you want some more shots let me know once again this is all in a 1990 d250 with a non intercooled rad support. fan rarely kicks on and when it does it drops in about 10 seconds Fan is out of a 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII (2 Speed Fan with High Speed Wired to the temp switch. low speed will be connected to a manual switch |
So, a question: Would this work with no ac delete? I assume that you took out the a/c condenser. It seems a bit illogical to me to need better cooling in a place where you don't need ac. This is from a guy that hikes in 115 plus heat all summer long. Did the truck have an over heating problem? I am just being Devil's advocate, it looks like good work, just questioning the need, besides the radiator leak...Mark Edit: I see that the condenser is still there...
|
Originally Posted by maybe368
(Post 3347686)
So, a question: Would this work with no ac delete? I assume that you took out the a/c condenser. It seems a bit illogical to me to need better cooling in a place where you don't need ac. This is from a guy that hikes in 115 plus heat all summer long. Did the truck have an over heating problem? I am just being Devil's advocate, it looks like good work, just questioning the need, besides the radiator leak...Mark Edit: I see that the condenser is still there...
|
Got it,There is always more to the story...Mark
|
| All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:04 PM. |
© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands