cam gear removal- need off tonight!!
 

I'm trying to get the rear portion of the timing case off because it is broken and I am down to nothing left but the case bolt that hides behind the big cam gear. Do I need a three finger puller to get that gear off? , thanx, crossy

The gear is pressed on to the cam. You have to pull the cam out of the engine to remove the rear timing case. I have never pulled one off but my understanding is that it has to be put in a press to remove it. I t has to be heated to about 350 to put it back on.

you can get it off while in truck but its a very pricey special puller and yes heat to go back on

Three jaw puller from NAPA or any auto/industrial supply place will pull the gear. Heat the gear in a toaster oven and it'll slide back on. Just remember to support the cam as it has no rear thrust surface, as the gear is it. Keep the cam pried forward when installing the gear.

usually about 300* for an interference right? I have to assume there IS a line up key of some sort due to timing ? holy Cow, if this doesn't work the price of my FREE help for this kid just went up. :-(.
thanx guys ----AND any links to this OR cam removal AND for timing mark line up would be appreciated. I haven't looked through stickys for that yet. crossy

300 degrees wold be the lowest I would heat to. The metal will not start to change at the molecular level until 400 degrees. As a millwright I have pulled and installed a lot of press fits. We usually heat them to 350 degrees because by the time you get the part on the shaft it will lose some heat. If it is too cool it will either not start on the fit or it will lock on before you have it in the right place on the fit. take note of its location on the fit before you pull it by taking a straight edge across the gear to the end of the cam and measure how far the gear is on the cam. Make sure it goes back on to that point. Let us know how it goes. Read the next post before you try pulling the gear.

If it does not want to pull off with the 3 jaw puller . Use heat from a torch to supliment the gear puller. Just make sure you keep the torch moving around the gear and heat it from the outside going in until it pops. Make sure you have the puller cranked up with full tension while you are heating it.
P.S. do not put the puller around the outside of the gear. use a 3 jaw and put the jaws of the puller through the holes it the gear so they pull on the center of the timing gear. It is cast iron and if you try to pull it from the outer circumfrance you will break it before it starts to pull off the cam.

@ lifer & others. the ultimate puller for THIS gear would have fingers that were turned 90* from the mounting position, but be that as it may I understand about the heat and pressure at same time as I am a maintenenace mech. by trade. Very seldom we have to do this old school type pulling anymore_NOT- the plant i work at is a dinosaur. ANYWAY since I have every sort of puller available to me other than what i needed i headed to TSC(tractor Supply) and bought an 8" Masterhand brand for $40. You can only get the finger into the backside if you have the gear in one position only ,and it requires removing the upper bolt out of the Camshaft retaining plate behind the gear to get that one fat finger in there. I picked this puller because it had the fingers that you can reverse and they are fairly flat on the backside because space to get it in there is at a minimum. The side of it i used also has bolt slots in them. the standard side of the fingers on this puller and even the next smaller size version would never get in there. I was afraid of that cast iron gear busting too, but i put pressure on it and heated to 350*-ish and tapped the puller's center bolt a few times. I let her cool down and on the fourth cycle of repeating that I heard that 'TING' that is either good news or bad news and it was good news. I got it. It wound off of there hard almost the whole way. NOW i have to do it all again to get the GOOD timing housing off of the BAD engine. I real glad for this kid that he got the engine for $500 cheaper because of the 'help' dropping it off the forklift and breaking the cover. I hope he tips me well :-) , thanx guys, Crossy

All I can say is GOOD LUCK pulling the gear in truck.

The puller that works for me is a three jaw that has a cage that tightens down on the outside to keep the jaws from spreading outward when you torque down on it.
Excellent product but I don't recall the brand name.

Sounds like its a Posi-lock brand puller. Do you know what number it is? I would guess its a 104 or a 106. The 104 will give 5 tons of pulling force, the 106 will give 10 tons but the 106 is about twice the size of the 104. I am going to need to pull my gear one of these days so I want to pick up one of these pullers. Its a fine line between enough pulling power and the phyisical size of the puller. I would guess it would need at least 5 tons to pull off the gear without having to heat it but it might need more.

My gasket between the block and timing case is leaking. When I fixed my kdp it was just about ready to fall out but my timing case bolts were all loose too. I cleaned everything up as good as possible and locktighted all the bolts but it is still leaking behind the injector pump at the gasket so I am going to need to pull the gear to take it all apart and put a new gasket in there.

here it is brother. Came off easy. what i learned from pulling the first one off in the garage was that You should put a hardened washer on the front of the cam because the first time the puller ground into the front of the cam.That causes no problem other than i didn't like it. I will admit that this one in the truck seemed to come off a bit too easy to get off.
The biggest PITA was getting the fan off. Luckily at the shop they had one of those nifty air hammer attachment kits. MAN! are those things sweet --remember-- left handed threads. LOL
Mysteriously though---- there was --NO-- KDP to be found in this engine.But it does havea completely melted piston in #6 cylinder. thanx for the help & hope that pic helps anyone who has to do it in truck. . Crossy

http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/v...earcummins.jpg

I see a propane torch in the picture, did you have to heat it?

@infedel- Not this one- this engine had already been severely overheated more than once and everything was loose. >LOL
I had my torch and laser pyrometer ready though.

Is this a 1st gen engine? Looks like a 1st gen vacum pump.
Did you have to remove the IP . Looks like it have be pure luck for those teeth to line up while sliding the hot gear on the cam shaft. Does the cam has a key ?

yep it's a first gen and in the first gen thread section. there are two different style vacuum pumps for the N/I and I/C engines. It's not pure luck- you do have a 1:72 chance, lol.. I made a hub from a broken cam gear to turn the cam. I also found out the engine will lock up like it's broke when the crank and cam dont turn together-- it's called pistons hitting valves. lol once I started turning the cam the engine turned over further. this was a unique situation here and i learned a lot from it I just wish i wasn't doing it ALLfor free. I JUST bought the barring tool, but didn't have it so i used balancer bolts in the front of the crank and a pry bar to turn it. WHEN you finally catch on-- and have the crank gear single O lined up with the cam gear DOUBLE OO's then the cam gears SINGLE O will already be in the right spot to line up with the IP gear letter E or C whichever you coose. The IP Gear has ONLY 6 different positions(more like notches) on the 360* scale so you may have to tweak the crank/cam gear combo with the barring tool to get the mark to line up, The IP is NOT responsive to light movement it 'pops' into it's next of six positions, this is especially important to know if you want to advance it a tooth like i did. I highlighted all the factory marks with a paint pen to make it all easier to see. this would really be helpful if viewing only thru the oil fill tube hole OR if your eyes are getting old ;-( . Crossy

found out the REAL reason i didn't have to heat it, there were two cracks in it and one was all the way through the center of the hub ,relieving the 'interference fit it was intended to have. I put the broken gear to good use and made a hub out of it that i used to turn the cam with gear teeth intereference.
I think i could talk anyone through this mess now. [coffee] Crossy

Kind of a old post.. But..
 

If the cam is removed with the gear still on. Can I use a press to remove the gear if I dont have the three jaw puller? Sounds straight forward, except I cant support the gear hub (where the jaws would hook) because the front cam bearing journal is almost bigger than the hub.

Or could I simply support the gear. Heat it fast with Oxy Acetylene Torch and let it drop out?

Thanks

the one i had to remove with a 3 jaw was way tighter than just a warm up would make it drop off. removing the cam requires 'other' removals first. you can rent/borrow 3 jaws from any auto store. Crossy

Yes press it off do not use the acetylene torch as you might get hot spots and make brittle spots that will crack later

Came off nicely in the press with a bearing splitter under the gear hub.

So oven heating only.. That's good to know dieseldemon because I was going to use our O.E. cherry bomb on the cam gear install, which we use to heat 200 hp pump motor couplers for install.

I have done a few cam removals in the last month. Mostly because of oil leaks from timing cover. You will need the tools which can be fabricated. Wooden dowels and a tube to install when cam is removed to prevent lifters from dropping into oil pan. Also to retrieve lifters if replacing. You will need to remove radiator and intercooler. AC condenser can stay in but needs to be unbolted from intercooler so cam will come out. Motor mount bolts need to be loosen so engine can be lifted about 10 inches so cam gear will clear bumper when pulled.


CAMSHAFT
1.Disconnect both battery negative cables.
2.Recover A/C refrigerant (if A/C equipped) (Refer to 24 - HEATING & AIR CONDITIONING/PLUMBING - STANDARD PROCEDURE).
3.Raise vehicle on hoist.
4. Drain engine coolant into container suitable for re-use (Refer to 7 - COOLING - STANDARD PROCEDURE).
5.Lower vehicle.
6.Remove radiator upper hose.
7.Remove viscous fan/drive/shroud assembly (Refer to 7 - COOLING/ENGINE/RADIATOR FAN - REMOVAL).
8.Disconnect the coolant recovery bottle hose from the radiator filler neck.
9.Disconnect lower radiator hose from radiator outlet.
10.Automatic Transmission models: Disconnect transmission oil cooler lines from front of radiator using Special Tool 6931 (unless equipped with finger-release disconnect).
11.Remove radiator mounting screws and lift radiator out of engine compartment.
12.Remove upper radiator support panel.
13.If A/C equipped, disconnect A/C condenser refrigerant lines.
14.Disconnect charge air cooler piping from the cooler inlet and outlet.
15.Remove the two charge air cooler mounting bolts.
16.Remove charge air cooler (and A/C condenser if equipped) from vehicle.
17.Remove accessory drive belt (Refer to 7 - COOLING/ACCESSORY DRIVE/DRIVE BELTS - REMOVAL).
18.Remove accessory drive belt tensioner.
19.Remove the fan support/hub assembly.
20.Remove crankshaft damper and speed indicator ring (Refer to 9 - ENGINE/ENGINE BLOCK/VIBRATION DAMPER - REMOVAL).
21.Remove the gear cover-to-housing bolts and gently pry the cover away from the housing, taking care not to mar the sealing surfaces. Remove dust seal with cover.
22.Using Special Tool 7471–B Crankshaft Barring Tool, rotate the crankshaft to align the timing marks on the crankshaft and the camshaft gears.
23.Remove the cylinder head cover (Refer to 9 - ENGINE/CYLINDER HEAD/CYLINDER HEAD COVER(S) - REMOVAL).




24.Remove the rocker arms, cross heads, and push rods. Mark each component so they can be installed in their original positions.
NOTE: The # 5 cylinder intake and the # 6 cylinder intake and exhaust pushrods are removed by lifting them up and through the provided cowl panel access holes. Remove the rubber plugs to expose these relief holes.






25.Raise the tappets as follows, using the wooden dowel rods provided with the Miller Tool Kit 8502. a.Insert the slotted end of the dowel rod into the tappet. The dowel rods for the rear two cylinders will have to be cut for cowl panel clearance. Press firmly to ensure that it is seated in the tappet.
b.Raise the dowel rod to bring the tappet to the top of its travel, and wrap a rubber band around the dowel rods to prevent the tappets from dropping into the crankcase.
c.Repeat this procedure for the remaining cylinders.






26.Verify that the camshaft timing marks are aligned with the crankshaft mark.
27.Remove the bolts from the thrust plate.
28.Remove engine mount through bolts.
29.Install engine support fixture special tool # 8534, and steel bracket/wing nut special tool # 8534A.
30.Raise engine enough to allow camshaft removal.
31.Remove the camshaft, gear and thrust plate.