That is not true.

 

Why is that? If it was truly farm use it would be exempt from CDL.

 

never said cdl, said class A. There is a way for it to be personal and not need a cdl.

 

Where do you get this "most states" at? Very few states offer a class A that is not a CDL.

Yup, it's called an RV.

 

Might not be for other states but don't come through Ohio without one.

In Ohio, once your on state maintained highways then you must follow ODOT regulations regardless of farm tags.

 

Please explain why I would need a CDL for a combination of 36k when the trailer is 10k?

Are you saying farm is not exempt form CDL in Ohio?

Why does it matter if it is state maintained or not?

 

Dont feed him cincy. Why do we have to explain anything to you. You seem to have all knowledge of every state even when shown to be wrong. As in states with a non cdl. Wether there is 5 or 20 that offer it. Its still a right answer and just proves your failure to read what is said. Find another user name and go trolling some more on other sites.

 

Since when is 5 most of 50?

 

doesnt really matter how many do the fact is they do. As stated in the first place.

 

For the purposes of this conversation it is.

Yes, RV. And a pickup hauling a dual tandem gooseneck is not an RV.

We've been over this so many times in this forum I should make it a sticky.

Here's the verbiage from the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration, (the people who make the rules and for whom I proof-read and suggest addendum's for new or proposed regulations and re-writes of existing material which makes me somewhat familiar with this stuff):

< 383.79 383.93 >

Subpart F - Vehicle groups and endorsements

§ 383.91Commercial motor vehicle groups. (a) Vehicle group descriptions. Each driver applicant must possess and be tested on his/her knowledge and skills, described in subpart G of this part, for the commercial motor vehicle group(s) for which he/she desires a CDL. The commercial motor vehicle groups are as follows:
(1) Combination vehicle (Group A)—Any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of 11,794 kilograms or more (26,001 pounds or more) provided the GVWR of the vehicle(s) being towed is in excess of 4,536 kilograms (10,000 pounds).

(2) Heavy Straight Vehicle (Group B)—Any single vehicle with a GVWR of 11,794 kilograms or more (26,001 pounds or more), or any such vehicle towing a vehicle not in excess of 4,536 kilograms (10,000 pounds) GVWR.

(3) Small Vehicle (Group C)—Any single vehicle, or combination of vehicles, that meets neither the definition of Group A nor that of Group B as contained in this section, but that either is designed to transport 16 or more passengers including the driver, or is used in the transportation of materials found to be hazardous for the purposes of the Hazardous Materials Transportation Act and which require the motor vehicle to be placarded under the Hazardous Materials Regulations (49 CFR part 172, subpart F).

Web address where this information can be found:
http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...91&keyword=CDL

So YES, if the trailer is going to be in excess of 10,000 lbs and the whole combination is going to be over 26,001 lbs, which it may well be with a camper added to the mix, a CDL will be needed. Seeing as how the trailer given in the original posters example probably weighs over 6000 empty, unless the load is 4000 lbs or under, it's going to be in the CDL class. And why would someone buy a trailer that'll haul 10,000 lbs if they're only going to put 4000lbs on it? The trailer that was given for the example has a GVWR of almost 26,000 by itself.

Although the Feds have a provision for farm operators, it is generally a state by state sort of thing. States can make their own rules as they see fit.

You will note the following definition from the FMCSA regarding farm operators:
Farm vehicle driver means a person who drives only a commercial motor vehicle that is—
(a) Controlled and operated by a farmer as a private motor carrier of property;
(b) Being used to transport either—(1) Agricultural products, or(2) Farm machinery, farm supplies, or both, to or from a farm;
(c) Not being used in the operation of a for-hire motor carrier;
(d) Not carrying hazardous materials of a type or quantity that requires the commercial motor vehicle to be placarded in accordance with §177.823 of this subtitle; and
(e) Being used within 150 air-miles of the farmer's farm.

You can find the entire definition here:
http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...aspx?reg=390.5

And before we even engage in the topic of what a commercial vehicle is or if your dually pickup can be considered as such, a commercial vehicle is any truck over 10,000 lbs, and it makes no mention of 'personal use' or 'for profit'. The formal definition is:

Commercial motor vehicle means any self-propelled or towed motor vehicle used on a highway in interstate commerce to transport passengers or property when the vehicle—
(1) Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating, or gross vehicle weight or gross combination weight, of 4,536 kg (10,001 pounds) or more, whichever is greater; or
(2) Is designed or used to transport more than 8 passengers (including the driver) for compensation; or
(3) Is designed or used to transport more than 15 passengers, including the driver, and is not used to transport passengers for compensation; or
(4) Is used in transporting material found by the Secretary of Transportation to be hazardous under 49 U.S.C. 5103 and transported in a quantity requiring placarding under regulations prescribed by the Secretary under 49 CFR, subtitle B, chapter I, subchapter C.

And in case you were wondering if you could be considered a 'Motor Carrier', (which means you need a CDL, need to comply with safety regs for commercial carriers, need a medical card, etc.), even if you don't do it for a living or profit, the definition is:
Private motor carrier means a person who provides transportation of property or passengers, by commercial motor vehicle, and is not a for-hire motor carrier.

Again, you can find this info at:
http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...aspx?reg=390.5

IN SUMMARY:
So you go and buy a used tractor that weighs 6000 lbs, you put it on your 6000 lb trailer, (12,000lbs), and tow it with your 7000lb truck, (19,000 lbs). Do you need a CDL? According to the Federal regs, NO. There is no mention of the truck having to weigh over or under 10,000 lbs in this case, just the GROSS weight of the COMBINATION being over 26,000 lbs, which this isn't. But if the GROSS COMBINATION was over 26,001 lbs, then YES, you'd need a CDL regardless of what the truck weighed because the trailer was over 10,000 lbs. They don't care that you're private, that your not making money to haul the tractor or that you're just a back yard tractor hobbyist. You need a medical card, a CDL and compliance with all the Federal safety regs, (warning triangles, chock blocks, fire extinguisher, vehicle logs for daily maintenance and driver hours where applicable, etc.) if the combination is over 26,001 and the trailer accounted for over 10,000 lbs of that weight. In the example above, substitute 'used tractor' for anything else that is heavy and fits on your trailer.

Because the states receive Federal funds for road maintenance and as a part of qualifying for those funds must follow certain Federal rules.

Let's not beat a dead horse. And PLEASE keep this civil or I'll mute one of you, ban the other and close the thread!

 

I agree that the OP will most likely need a CDL class A. But to say "pulling any trailer and grossing over 26,000 then you'll need a class A" isn't correct on many fronts.

The weight of the trailer and load and whether or not it has the camper on or not essentially makes no difference here. DL requirements are based off of GVWR not GVW.

Actually it does.

Personal use is exempt from part 390 as spelled out in the applicability of part 390.

That would depend on the GVWR of the truck and trailer.

Many of the things you list here are part of section 390. So they may or may not be needed.

Have you heard of any state having different DL requirements depending on whether it is a state or federally funded road?

 

If the Federal Government is supplying funds for maintenance and construction of such roads they can require a state to do just about anything. In Alabama we have been subject to some strange requests by the feds. In summary let's close this license discussion by agreeing on a couple basic points. First, the OP is looking for a trailer that most likely is going to have a minimum GVWR of 21k based on a triple 7k axle configuration. That GVWR combined with the weight of his power unit will put him in CDL territory, and that's it. Additionally, since pulling competitively is a for profit venture, and if I'm correct in assuming he'll be pulling with a dually, he will have to get DOT numbers for the power unit. The numbers for operating within the state (Intrastate) vs the numbers for operating across state line (Interstate) are different.

Now let's come back on topic and continue. As far as my choice, the dual tandem will probably give you less heartache in the big picture. I might opt for a few feet longer and a heavier set of axles. The difference shouldn't be that much more. I didn't see a light weight for the trailer listed in the link you provided and in addition to the weight of the trucks, you also have to factor in the camper, accessories, and pulling weights. You might consider having a rack built between the frame rails, over the axles for those. I've always found that no matter how well I plan out the use, I always need more deck space. Remember to check your height. You mentioned hauling a first gen with a slide-in camper. You may find you're over the maximum allowable height.

Let's stay on topic now please.

 

I agree. As a matter of fact, I agree so much that I just purchased a used dual tandem 20 ton equipment trailer! Not that I had the extra money laying around, but I couldn't pass up the deal; 98 Eager Beaver, bought new in spring of 99, never registered. The owner backed off the brakes because he had nothing with air to run them anyway. Pulled the trailer around his large campground with a C-60 Chevy and an JD 490 excavator on the trailer. That's all he's ever done with it. It's never seen pavement! Needs paint and I'll pull the brakes and bearings apart to see what condition everything is in before pulling it back to Michigan from Massachusetts, but other than that, everything is good. Even has a new white oak deck on it!

 

Actually it does.

Personal use is exempt from part 390 as spelled out in the applicability of part 390.

Quote:
f) Exceptions. Unless otherwise specifically provided, the rules in this subchapter do not apply to—

(3) The occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise;


These exceptions were designed for Uhaul, Ryder, Penske, Budget, truck rentals that would otherwise require a CDL to operate but excuses the need for a CDL if rented and used by a private individual to move house hold goods from one location to another.

 

you guys aint gonna do any good with him