bobgay

Somebody please help a novice. I am towing a 24' TT, but am buying a new truck, ane want to have the capability to switch to a larger trailer, probably a 5th Wheel. I'm looking at a 2003 Ram 3500 Quad 4x4 with the H.O. diesel and 6-sp trans. I'm concerned with pin weight, and confused about payload determination. The Dodge towing guide on the net says GVWR is 9,900#, curb weight is 7,080# and payload is 2,820#. Edmunds says vehicle weight is 6,868# and payload is 3,030#. I guess the difference could be that one includes an allowance for the driver, but Edmunds also says the F-350 weighs 6,187# and has a payload of 3,710#. Am I reading this right?<br>I'm also considering a short bed, because I don't wand a dually. Will this be a headache to maneuver, or will a sliding hitch take care of it? I have a friend with a F-250 short bed, and he says he never uses his slide. <br>Finally, I prefer a 3.73 rear end for the lower RPM and better mileage when not towing. Will this truck pull a fair sized 5th wheel (say 10,000 to 12,000#) satisfactorily without going to a 4.10?<br>Thanks in advance for any help you can give me.<br>BobbyG<br>

Bluedresser

Bobby - Can't help you much with 5th wheels, but is one of those gross weights for the dually as opposed to the SRW? Or, is one of those weights for a 4x4 and the other for a 4x2, or is one of those weights for a short bed and the other for the long bed? You might check that out. Also, you can get the 3500 long bed in a SRW. Lots of luck. Just picked up my Ram 3500 dually 4x2 long bed, HO w/six, love it so far but only have 75 miles on it.

Big dawg

Bobby,<br> First off Welcome to the site. Loads of great information being passed around. I've learned a ton of info and would have been lost without this site. <br> Not sure they make a 3500 without being a dually. I've only seen the other brands with them. As for the gear ratio, the 373 will do just fine for your load ( I wish they made them for my 2500). The H.O. is a work horse and it will move your soon to be 5er without a problem. There are a couple of 3500 where I live that pull 5ers with the WT of anywhere from 14,500 up to 16,000. <br> Your pin WT will vary between makers of the 5er's, however the 3500 your purchasing will handle the WT. Just don't over do it. <br> I would get the long bed with the trailer/camping towing option ( if possible). With a short bed your going to have to get a glider hitch (which is not a bad thing) but I perfer the long bed. <br> There are others on this site that know much more than I do, so this is only my .02 worth. Hope the info helps...<br>Big dawg

FiverBob

Bobby G,

Welcome to the site. Enjoy. Good stuff here. Let me try to answer your question about weight rating.
A quad cab 3500 HO 4x2 has a max payload rating of 4460 lbs. The SO is 4650. Obviously, you need to subtract for full fuel tanks, passengers, hitches, tools, etc. The towing cap for the HO is 16,300, minus as above. I did not get technical here, so there can be other things getting into the formula, but that is a good starting place.

Big Dawg,

3500 SRW is the standard in '03. Dually is an option. Lot's of happy people over that one.

FiverBob

pwabbott

Welcome, Bobby G, if you are planning for a 5er in the future there are several reasons for the Long Bed with your preference of single rear wheels. First, there in need for the slider hitch which cost on an average $200 extra. Second, you don't have as to whether or not you need to use the slider feature in a particular situation. The long bed is more stable towing and is more comfortable riding. The extra room in the bed is great for taking bulky items that won't fit in storage compartments. With a short bed there is little room for extra gear.<br><br>The only advantage of the SB over the LB is a shorter turning radius of 22ft compared 25ft<br><br>My previous tow vehicle 98 Ram Quad with SB my new tow vehicle 03 Ram Quad with LB, so I have used both. My advice is go with the Long Bed.<br><br>Since you live in Florida the 3.73 axle will be OK as you don't have high mountain passes with long grades. If you plan to travel &quot;from sea to shining sea&quot;, the 4.10 rear axle gives you greater towing capacity of up to 2000# for engine and body style combination.<br>There is not much difference in fuel mileage between the two, less than one mile to the gallon driving solo, no trailer. The 4.10 may even have a slight advantage when towing since the engine will be running at a shightly higher more efficient rpm.<br><br>My SO 2003 Ram 5spd, 4.10 axle is far from being broken in and is improving with each tank. Towing mileage is over 12.5 mpg with over 50% on mountain roads. Around town mileage is up to 18.6 mpg. Freeway mileage is now 20.4 mpg.<br><br><br>Take your time in making a decision. You may what to check out 5ers for the kind you think would meet your needs in the future. <br><br>Good luck!

bobgay

Thanks guys for all the good info. It sure is nice to have access to such knowledgeable people. You have convinced me that I want a long bed. I was considering a short bed only because the dealer I had talked to led me to believe the LB came only in DRW.<br>Phil, even though I live in Fla, I will be doing a lot of traveling, mountains included. What you say about the 4.10 axle makes sense, but couldn't you compensate by using 4th or 5th gear on the long grades. I have heard several people say they felt they needed a 7th gear when at highway speed with the 4.10 (and even with the 3.73). Do you get this feeling with yours? Speaking of being broken in, I've heard you need 500 miles or so on the truck before you tow. Is this right?<br>Thanks, BobbyG

ladyram

BobbyG,<br><br>Do yourself a big favor and get the long bed, 4:10's and the dully's if you are thinking of a 5'r in that wt range. Visit the RV form rv.net and do a search on the 4:10 and dully questions. You'll find most RV'rs pulling 5th wheels feel the dully's and the 4:10's are the best way to go and they'll give you their reasons.<br><br>Yes, you do need to drive you truck about 500 miles before you tow.<br><br>

bobgay

Ladyram - Thanks for the input. I'll check out that site.

pwabbott

BobbyG, here is the link to Good Sam Club Forum. http://www.goodsamclub.com/forums/index.cfm/CFB/1.cfm<br>. Base your decision on your actual future needs. Study the specifications of 5ers and tow vehicles.<br><br>Lady Ram's 5er, a 2880RL has a dry weight of 9130# and a gross vehicle weight rating of 12100#, with hitch wt of 1940#. The 2500 Diesel with 4.0 rear axle is more than adequate to tow her trailer anywhere in the US highway on grades less than 10%. My 5er has a dry weight of 9030# an my 2003 has towed up 8% grade passing other 5ers on the way in 4th gear (high 1:1 ratio).

ladyram

Sierra Phil,<br><br>Uh...you did mean to say her &quot;3500&quot; not &quot;2500&quot;...right?

pwabbott

LadyRam, I said it correctly the 2500 is more than adequate to tow your Montana 2880RL model loaded to it's GVWR capacity. The exception would be if your 5er is loaded beyond it's capacity. If so, getting a dually does not correct an overloaded trailer condition.

My 2955RL Montana loaded for travel is just under 11,000#. My 2003 standard output CTD 5 speed Tranny with 4.10 axle and long bed has a GTWR of 13,450#. It also has a GCWR of 20,000#.
A 13,450# tow rating is more that capable of towing 11,000# trailer, or in your case a 12,100# trailer (the GVWR for your 5er.)

BobbyG, If you decide to go with the 3500 consider that the single rear wheel option. As Fiver Bob said many people are happy it is available. Your statement, &quot;I'm also considering a short bed, because I don't want a dually. Will this be a headache to maneuver, or will a sliding hitch take care of it? I have a friend with a F-250 short bed, and he says he never uses his slide.&quot;, indicates you are aware of awkwardness of manuvering a dually in parking lots and even on some narrow highways. The short bed option on the 2003 Ram is about 3 inches shorter than the 2002 Ram models. This from my experience with a short bed 98 Ram would necessitate much more frequent use of the slider feature.

P Kennedy

Bobby G you will save yourself a lot of grief by taking a tape measure with you trailer shopping, get the unit spec sheet you would like to buy and make notes about some things you look into yourself. Use the tape to measure #1 distance from center of kingpin to outside left or right front corner (minimum radius to turn) as not all trailers have the same kingpin setting on the front of trailer, more overhang means more radius. #2 measure from the center of hitch where hole for kingpin goes forward to back of cab/headache rack, fuel tank/pumps above box level this measurement will be Maximum amount of room for turning radius of front corner of trailer, this distance should be 6&quot; longer than measurement #1 due to uneven ground, hitting the brakes or a combination. Dual pivot hitches need more room, this is the only sure way to know if a trailer kingpin setting truck box combination is going to work. #3 go to dealer with trailer spec and weights and let them help you which chassis combo will carry it as the warranty is theirs not the trailer manufacturer. If the sales person can't work it out get somebody else even if it means a different dealer, the sales handout does not have all the answers but every dealer has a complete chassis application manual if not go home. Remember folks you are spending your money at your risk not theirs. PK

moss2904

I have towed with both SRW shortbeds ( since 1997) and a LWB dually (one month). I have tried extended pins, standard pins, sliding Reeses hitches, and non slding hitches with the SWB. <br> One thing I can say without a doubt I do not miss having to watch the trailer truck cab clearance with the shortbed while turning. <br> I was going to buy another Ford SWB CC till I happened to park next to a 2003 Dodge Quad cab dually. When I saw the overal length was within inches of each other I went and bought the Dodge.<br> After using the LWB briefly I would not want another SWB for towing a fifth wheel. It sure is easy when you are backing in to a spot and all you have to worry with is where you want the trailer not, how can I get the trailer in there with my SWB? <br> Another thing that seemed to always happen to me the tighter the parking spot the busier the road always seemed. Nothing like trying to make a Reese sliding fifth wheel hitch behave when you are trying to get out of the road while blocking traffic.<br>FWIW Randy

pwabbott

moss2904, Here, here, Amen!

To me a short bed truck is one before you buy a 5er. You find that after buying a 5er that your short bed was not designed for towing a 5er, and the 5er was not designed to be towed by a short bed. The &quot;Catch 22&quot; is after buying the 5er you discover that you cant afford to trade-in the short bed on the long bed you need to tow the 5er. So you make do with the short bed using an invention called a &quot;slider&quot; so you will be able to find more camp sites that you can back into.

Finally in frustration the wife says, &quot;take out a 3rd mortgage on the house and get rid of this short bed truck. I'm not going to stand out back yelling at me every time you can back this ---- short bed truck.

bobgay

You all have convinced me. I'm off to shop for a long bed, probably a dually. I'll let you know how it comes out. Thanks for all the help.BobbyG