madhat

Mornin, DTR.
Had another member, Scotty, bring to my attention a couple of instances of wheel studs shearing off and causing tires to come off at highway speeds... the studs just sheared off without warning.

Some members found damaged studs during tire rotation or brake service.

Look at your studs, don't over torque.

If you have other info about this, please bring it up.


mad

Diesel Dave2

I can't remember what a full set of wheel lugs are,but I will find out...I think I'm going to replace all of mine as a PM..

Now what about the front hub bolts on the duallys??There is also 8 lugs there that attach to the bearing...(This hub attachs to the bearing with 8 nuts and the wheel attachs to the hub with another 8 nuts)..Has anyone sheared off the hub lugs??

Diesel Dave2

I was just think about the hub bolts(duallies only)...These don't get removed that often and should be ok..But I found on my truck,the torque was low...As I remember the torque is 140 ft/lbs..Mine where 100 ft/lbs..If replacing the wheel lugs...check the torque on the hub nuts also..

Nick02Ram

Some of that has to do with whoever does your tires. Most of your everyday car tire places dont think to tighten truck lugs a bit tighter than cars. 100 ft/lbs is what i always do for cars, 125-140 for trucks.

and I personally, have never seen dually hub studs broken before. I beleive they are a heavier duty bolt than the wheel stud.

wannadiesel

Most of the time this is due to loose wheels. Aluminum wheels have a bad habit of loosening up, so it's a good idea to recheck them within 50 miles after putting them on the truck.

Scotty

whatever may cause this problem...

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...p-t276630.html

It is one that can get overlooked, or over torqued as well as under torqued.
Or maybe wear and tear, just like other components on our trucks.

Threads and bolts stretch/fatigue over time.

My friend lost the front right on his Ford dually 4x4...he knew better as he addressed this on his Ram dually after one sheared and he had to replace the front unit bearing and several other parts. He rotates and torques them himself to 140. The one tire shop I used to go to would go to 180 on the dually's.

Tate

Depends on the shop. The shop I worked at out of high school would impact them on loose and then use a torque wrench to bring them to torque. Other shops just use an impact. Some use torque sticks, others just hammer them on. A friend of a family had a flat tire once on an old car, needed a 4 foot snipe on the old cross and two guys pulling on it to get the lug nuts off. Last place that tire was worked on was at a tire shop.

Rednax

Copied this awhile back on this issue:

BenK (www.rv.net)
The main difference with steel vs alloy wheels is that on steel wheels the
lug hole is 'coined' during the stamping process.

'Coined' hole is where the metal is upset into a 3rd dimension from just the hole. It is raised and tapered to match the lug face taper. For those naysayers, just do a search using 'coined' 'wheel' 'lug hole'.

This will have the raised area compressed during the tightening of the lug
nut/bolt, which then acts like a locking mechanism because it keeps a
constant pressure on the lug nut or bolt.

Alloy is usually aluminum based and it is NOT able to be coined and then
last long under that condition. The alloy will fatigue and fail. Some alloys
do, but mainly dually and commercial class. I've never seen nor heard of
them on 'P' or 'LT' class alloy wheels.

Usually alloy wheels has shouldered lug nuts. Some have tapered and
those I've found only on forged alloy wheels. This design depends on the
tension of the fastener shank stretch to hold.

Those indicators are good and indicative of high risk unions and the
fasteners critical to the performance of whatever it is holding together.
Think of safety wired fasteners.

What happens is that during dynamic usage and it is worse under ever
higher loads. Is that the fastener stretches ever so slightly to
see no tension (stretch and the rubber band pull to hold the fastener from
turning) to then allow it to unwind a bit. This adds up over time to find the holding force no longer able to keep it together.

There are bell nuts, Belleville washers, etc but they are expensive
and usually lost during service of the wheel/tire.

Why alloys should be re-torqued after the first few hundred miles
after taking them off (loosening). Then again every few thousand
and this is NOT cast in stone. Some will hold from the get go while others
will need constant re-torquing....what Grillmeister said, as the fastener has gone past its yield point and will NEVER hold their rated torque.

http://forums.woodalls.com/Index.cfm...g/1/page/2.cfm

The common torque spec for “dry” threads on a grade 8 bolt is 120 ft lb.

that about line up with a bolt torqued to 75% of yield strength. If you
have lube on the threads that spec no longer applies and the torque needs to be lower as if not you can go over 100% of yield. When you approach yield strength or go over it, the threads stretch and then it is down hill from there.

If you suspect you have thread stretch, a way that may show it is, jack up
the TT, pull a wheel off. Find a new 1/2-20 hex nut from the hardware
store and try and screw it on by hand all the way to the brake drum. If it
starts binding up, odds are the threads have stretched. And if that is the
case, new studs are needed.

And then there is the nut. If you do not have a grade 8 nut, then the stud may be OK and the nut will stretch.

As was said if your torque wrench is 10% off in calibration, it can be
applying 132 ft lb of torque as that will be an issue. It may not be that
bad but it is something to check.

A hint for those who find their lug nuts not holding during a trip.
Use some fishing mono filament line to wrap the stud threads for the
first few threads (around 3-5). Then put on the nut and tighten. That
plastic will act like a nyloc fastener....but....note that the stud
has gone past its yield point and no longer capable of it's design
clamping force/torque. So take it easy and slow down. Way down...this
is just a band aid to get you home.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


LUG NUT TELL-TALE
http://www.wheel-check.com/


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NJTman

Thank you for this post #8

Very informative.

Argo

I just had this happen to me. I currently have 3 lugs that popped off this week. I took it to the dealer and they ordered the lugs for me. Said he had never seen it.... I told him that is a BS line, he said it would not be a warranty item, I also told him BS. I asked to talk to the service manager. He said he would approve it for warranty but the regional chrysler person is at my dealership.... He said that guy may not pass it through because of the aftermarket tires. I told him I had 3 other tires that were just fine, it is only happening on one tire. I will argue with him too if I have to but order the parts and lets get it done.... After 10k miles on these rims and tires why would they just pop off? Something is not right. I have a cap over my lugs so I had 2 of them in hand to show him. He could tell it was not from being stressed or over tourqed.... I told him I tqd them to 135, he said thats within the specs for the 140 and his variances.... I even carry the wrench in my truck so I could show him, I have to use a deep socket to get the lugs out and use the wrench every time and keep it ready just in case I have a flat....

Anyway, I will take pictures in the morning to post of the actual damage. The parts are ordered and the dealer agreed to do it at a discounted price, employees discount, if i have to pay out of pocket. Will be $200 for all 8 lugs to be changed including parts and labor. I will keep you guys informed. I had 95k on my other 2500 without a problem with aluminum wheels and 35" tires, which is what I have on this 3500.

this is on my 2009 megacab 3500 4x4

zulusafari

This happened to me, too. I lost all eight wheel studs under load, carrying my truck camper and towing my car on a dolly. Very rough highway in western Iowa, close to midnight. I think an animal of sone sort (I didn't inspect it) ran under the truck, which rode over it - deer or dog, not sure, saw the carcass laying by the rode farther back just as we were leaving. Felt a lurch and a bang, with the truck swerving into the oncoming lane (empty, thankfully!) and then another bang and the truck dropping downward. I knew I was sitting on the shoulder for the night when I saw the wheel and tire pass me, heading for the opposite ditch. I found it in a farmer's field, and the alluminum was all chewed up, and the inside of the tire was shredded. Upon inspecting the broken pieces left in the flange, there were some dark spots showing possible cracks.

I replaced the studs on the side of the road the next day, along with a new rear rotor - the other one was braken from riding it to the shoulder. What I didn't realize, was the backing plate (called the Parking Brake Adapter) was also bent, and the rear caliper was twisted against the rotor. It took me a week to find one of those adapters, as they were on National Backorder.

I change my tires for winter and summer driving, as the Hummer rims and tires are primarily for holding higher loads when camping. Between swapping tires and doing rotations over 140k miles, plus the higher load put on them, they gave out. We were fortunate there weren't any vehicles in the oncoming lane, and also that we came to rest far enough off the roadway. The Sheriff's office wasn't happy with the clearance, but they couldn't see any other alternatives either. Even if they towed my truck from under the camper, there wasn't anyone around that could move the camper off the road.

catnfool

just watched my wheel pass me today!! I had a trailer load of firewood on, and the nuts vibrated off. Tire missed the oncoming durango; I pooped a little!! I had torqued them to 110 a week ago; 125 it is from now on!!

Grit Dog

I'll have to look into this.
I am noticing some of the lugs are increasingly harder to thread on, but not cross threaded.
I use antiseize on the lugs and have had the wheels off probably 20-25? times over the life of the truck so far, 100k mi.

I admit, I just rattle the lugs on. Torqued them once and got a feel for what my impact does. They're not way over tightened and not loose.

If it's stretching, it has to be the nuts, as they go on hard right from the get go, not just where they seat against the rim.

Busboy

The antiseize is your problem and every single stud and nut is over stretched, 135 foot lbs is the dry torque value, with the antiseize it could be as low as 80ft lbs.

Good post #8 by Radnex some very useful information for the non professional there.

Argo

So I have lost 3 more lugs over the last year or so. Why isn't dodge recalling this issue? The dealer gave me half off but it should be free.... 20% failure is pretty bad.... 6 of 32 lugs sheared on mine. Also, dealers have told me the specs are for 140 lbs on my 2009....