i currently drive a 1969 coronet (b-body dodge musclecar if you're not familiar) with a 318 sb as my daily driver, and even with only a 318 the gas prices are killing me. in the future i want to heavily modify it and make it just plain stupid fast (ive been researching doing a twin-turboed aluminum block 408 stroker) but the prospect of gas prices topping $4 or more in the near future is really discouraging me from going a gasoline route, and the poor availability of both methanol and ethanol tosses an alcohol engine out the window too. with that in mind i've been trying to assess the viability of a cummins conversion into my car. the current surge in diesel race technology has yielded cummins engines easily passing 1000 lb-ft torque (not that you didnt already know that) and still getting over 20mpg... the idea of that in a car that could kill anything on the street yet still be a reliable and mildly affordable driver is extremely appealing. i need some information and opinions on this. i have been unable to locate figures on the dimensions and weight of the 5.9L cummins engines in the ram trucks, so if any of you know how big they are (figures would be great) please let me know. also, what do you think of this idea? how would a big diesel change the driving characteristics of the car (i.e. would it still be a good driver, or would it not be worthy for anything except the track)? im trying to think 10-20 years in the future here, when oil will be a completely impractical fuel source (biodiesel will of course still be available).

also, what is the reality of doing this with a bt4 engine? how much power are the cummins 4 cylinders capable of making, and how big are they in camparison to the 5.9L (weight, dimensions)?

note: flaming is not appreciated- i realize the out-there-ness of this idea, and i am a total noob when it comes to diesel, so please respond with informed and useful advice
furthermore, if i decide to proceed with this project the car will be custom tailored to the engine and potential power it will make, including full cage/tube chassis integrated to the existing frame, custom suspension built to handle the added weight and power, etc etc etc, not that that wouldn't be done with my TT stroker idea

any and all help is much appreciated!

 

There's no way you'd get the hood to close, the valve covers would be about 4 inches above the hoodline. Length and width would be no problem with either engine. Weight would be an issue with the 5.9, you'd have to build some serious suspension and run 16" tires, at least load range D.

I hate to say it, but if you want a diesel in a car you are better off using the GM 6.2/6.5 family. Those will fit anywhere a big-block V-8 will go. There are shops that can help you get reliable power out of them, plenty good for hauling a Coronet around and still getting 18 - 20 mpg. One of those would be a bettter choice than the 4bt Cummins from a power/size/smoothness standpoint anyway.

 

JUST THE ENGINE weighs 1000-1100 pounds. That's not counting the transmission, which would end up being a heavy one to withstand the torque. The weight of a big block chrysler, all decked out in iron, is a little less than 700 pounds if memory serves me. The entire chassis of the car would have to be beefed up, not just the springs. I'm not talking about just welding subframe connectors in, either. I have cracked the windshield in my dually from flex when working mine hard. This is in a truck that came with the diesel from the factory. I'm gonna give an educated guess that a rollcage would be necessary.

Like the others said, you would also not be able to close the hood. The engine is so long that you would be lucky to have room for a radiator with the back touching the firewall, even on a b body like your car. The back of the engine would be under the cowl, except it wouldn't fit because of height. A dana 60 would probably withstand the torque in a traction limited car. If you ever got it to hook well enough to apply any real portion of the torque it could make, you'd probably crack or break windows in the car, even with a decent chassis. The front suspension would be particularly fun, as there is no torsion bar made for the car that's remotely stiff enough. You might be able to crank down on a set of big block torsion bars enough to technically support the front of the car, but they would have a spring rate WAY WAY below what is needed to keep body roll to a minimum. Ever drive a big block a body with /6 torsion bars? It just about falls over going around corners. It's great for weight transfer in a straight line, terrible for daily driving. This is the situation you would be in, except it would probably be even worse because the diesel is SO much heavier than a big block. I would not be surprised if the torsion bar mounts then twisted and broke because they're not designed to have nearly that much torque applied.

My advice is to give it up, in other words. You would essentially be jacking up the cigarette lighter and sliding a new car under it.

 

This might be a better solution for you:

This '70 Coronet was on the Power Tour with us:

He had the ability to walk away from all of us(472 Hemi, 500 Wedge, 451 Stroker)

Behold, a turbocharged 360. He was getting 20 mpg on 87 octane fuel.


He's on Moparts and goes by the user name, "Snailpower". A really good guy.

 

I guess, with all due respect, I sense some placing of a "nickle before a dollar" here...Your original reason for the change is the $4/gal gasoline (or more) oncoming. Well, you can buy a lot of $4/gas (or diesel - it'll be there too) for even half of the cost of the modifications you're considering making to such a car. Then factor in your own time (give yourself a labor rate, if you want) and it would have to be one really special dream car you wanted to make it worthwhile.

Personally, I would love to install a 5.9 Cummins into say, an older '50's era truck; One-ton or heavier. But into a car? Sorry it's a tractor engine....Just tooooo heavy and slow turning for a passanger car. It's also closer to 1250 lbs with fluids, and the radiator you would have to use (don't forget an intercooler) would likely add another 250-300 lbs with coolant.

There WAS a Cummins in a car - a race car at that, in the '30's. The frames back then were designed to handle massive V-12's V-16's and straight 8's. One of these cars would easily accept such a 5.9 - rather a lightweight engine for them. Here's the article:
http://americanhistory.si.edu/onthem...bject_365.html

I know it's crazy, but if you could find an old Volvo diesel wagon from the '80's, it has a beefed up suspension, and could likely accept a 4bt. What a fun sleeper this car would make...No one would suspect it...But the 4bt will rattle you silly at idle and still weighs at least 800 lbs.

Perhaps you could just build up your mopar and find a cheap 4-cylinder car like a Civic to commute with. good luck!

 

Help may be on the way:

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...d.php?t=110540

 

augh! don't get a Civic... I prefer the Neon- at least it has "chrysler character"

but my commuter IS a Honda... Shadow Sabre 1100.. put about 400 miles a week on it..

 

[QUOTE=Lunyfringe]augh! don't get a Civic... I prefer the Neon- at least it has "chrysler character"

...And Zero resale value...

 

Looky, Looky, a Diesel corvette, this is too Cool.
http://www.thedieselpage.com/readers/vet.htm

 

[QUOTE=96_12V]I didn't say get a NEW Neon... you can't- they replaced it with the Caliber..

I used the low resale value to my advantage..

picked up a '99 with a grinding 2nd gear and a check engine light and 130k miles for $500... replaced intake manifold gasket (cleared CEL), and match rpms when shiifting- and I get 38mpg on a $500 car... and I do have a spare transmission I got for $75 to replace when I have time...

also, with the very little work I've done on Hondas/acuras, I hated... they're a PITA... had to pull an axle to change a alternator??? c'mon!

but I'll give you that if you want to buy new, don't get a Neon... and I'm not fond of the Caliber, either...

 

So how much is 48 mpg canadian compared to US mpg? That is a cool idea if you have a spare 'vette laying around.

 

I believe Canada uses Imperial gallons, so:
1 Imperial gallon = 1.201 U.S. gallon.

Therefore 48mpg Can. ~ 40mpg U.S., 55mpg Can. ~ 45.8mpg U.S.

Wait a minute! Do they use Kilometers in Canada? Hmm...

 

40 mpg's from a 6L V8 sounds a little out there. the drag coefficient is much better than a truck, but seriously, double the mileage?


back to topic:



just put a hole in the hood like any other hotter rodder who couldnt fit it would! those valve covers would look sweeet sticking out the hood!


on a side note, if he was actually able to get 20 MPG's and walk away from big blocks with a turbo 360, i would jump all over that!

 

The big difference is weight. A Chevy 1-ton is almost 8000 lbs. I'm willing to bet a '77 Vette is closer to 3500 Lbs.

 

a gen 3 vette is around 4k. not exactly light, but its no 8000 lbs.