Bart Timothy

In my mind diesel isn't near as attractive as it once was. It used to always be at least a nickle a gallon cheaper than gas in the summer and usually only a nickle above in the winter, around these parts. Today it is anywhere from 20 to 50 cents a gallon more all the time. It took about 100,000 miles at the old fuel prices to make up for the $4500 increase in sticker price I paid for my Cummins. Then if you're paying to have your oil changed, that runs 10 to $12 more per change. Plus, the new ultralow sulpher fuel has knocked mileage down 1 to 2 mpg, and the diesel option when up another $1500 to $2000 to cover the new emissions requirements on new trucks, and cost another couple of miles per gallon. Any operational cost advantage diesel had, has disappeared.

Meanwhile the new gassers are getting better fuel milage all the time, and more power to boot. Friends I have who have Hemis almost get as good as fuel milage out on the highway, running empty, as my truck does. I've seen the gassers on the dyno. The new Hemis, Tundras and Titans are all close to 300hp at the wheel now. The power gap between diesels and gassers has gone down.

Two areas it's better at. Diesels pay off if your doing lots of heavy towing. Running empty, there is no advantage. The other area where they excell is if you don't want to leave things stock. It is a lot easier and cheaper to get healthy power increases out of a diesel than out of a gasser.

My .02 worth rant is over.

Marty86

Went to the Transmission shop today for the Ranger. It seems that my hard shift between 2 and 3 either means a new valve body, or a valve body and a rebuild. Either way, not cheap. Plus, I just talked with my father in law, and he's decided he's going to be selling the Ram soon, as he wants to get his own diesel. I've pretty much decided not to pay for the transmission, and just start saving til I get to at least 10k, and then put a nice downpayment on either a newer Ram 2500 or a newer 1500. Hemi or Diesel, whichever is going to be nicer and better for me money wise.

I think I want to diesel still though. I met someone yesterday who's daily driver was a 2001 2500, who said he only ever uses the bed of the truck for yard work around his house, but the fact that he can pull anything (and he has done it once or twice) is something that keeps him satisfied with paying a little more for ability to do that, and just the niceness of a diesel.
Can anyone say they feel the same way?

Sea:\>Drive

Yup feel the same way. Only use the bed when a friend/neighbor needs it (or to run to the dump after cleaning up my own yard). I bought it for mileage, longevity, and towing ability. I have a 6500# boat I trailer during the summer. Yes my E-150 van would do it, but it never really liked it. I commute 50+ miles daily with mine. I needed one vehicle that could tow 6500# easily, get good mileage, and give me longevity (I keep vehicles a long time). The CTD was the answer to all my questions.

DBLR

What ever you do don't let anyone tell you that a Dodge 1500 with a 4.7L will get better mpg then a 3/4 ton truck with a diesel engine. I took a trip over the same roads as I did in my 1500, but I also took a side trip in to Yellowston park that my 1500 did not take and I still got better mpg then I did out of the 4.7L V8 in my 2005 Dodge 1500 QC 4x4. I only got 16.0 mpg in my 1500 and got 18.5 mpg with the CTD. Btw the truck only had 5400 miles on it after the 4K trip so the engine was not even broke-in yet. Good luck with what ever way you go gas or diesel.

Grit Dog

If you're comparing a 2nd Gen Cummins truck to a 360 Dodge Gasser or a 5.7 Hemi (w/o MDS). You're looking at say 19mpg avg vs. 13mpg avg. Over 100k mi assuming diesel at $3/gal and gas at $2.80/gal, that's a $5700 savings in fuel alone. Typical oil change maintenance, incl a fuel filter for the diesel every 10k mi, diesel oil change at 7500mi intervals, gas at 3000mi intervals, the diesel is going to cost a couple hundred more $ in maint cost. Assuming air filters cost about the same, they're all expensive now.
Looks to me you'd have around $5k to spend on "additional repairs" to the diesel in order to break even w/ a gas 1/2 ton.
If you're comparing to something that gets good fuel economy (not a Dodge 1/2 ton V-8 anything) then it would be more economical than a diesel.
I know my Dmax gets 50% better mileage in all conditions, town, highway, towing than my 01 Ram 1500 Q/C 4x4, 360motor. Maintenance costs are a little higher on the DMAX, including fuel filter and trans spin on at every oil change, but it still more than makes up for the difference in mileage. Plus I sold it at 120k mi, immaculate condition, not a work truck and got only $7500 after trying a long time to sell it. The 2500 Cummins version of my truck was about $5k more in '01, and I probably could have sold it for close to $15k.

RamWheelsBy4

My nephew has a 2004 VW Golf with a 1.9L TDI that gets around 45mpg, has quite a bit of room, is fun to drive and not really girly at all.

JyRO

I agree with a diesel losing some of it mpg advantages here lately ... especially the DPF trucks. I also agree when pulling heavy, the diesel still whomps the gas.

My truck doesn't do too much empty driving these days, which I'm glad for. The rice-a-roni and 39 mpg get's that job. But I have consistently pulled 15k GCW down the road and averaged 13 mpg. Granted I only run 65 mph on the interstate. But if I had a Hemi and was getting 13 mpg, knowing a DC like mine was getting the same mpg pulling 15K GCW down the road would irk me to no end.

Diesel wins. I just hope that OEM's come up with a better way to deal with particulates versus spraying it with diesel and burning it up. It not only sounds dangerous, but is wastefull.

- JyRO

Marty86

Gah. I dunno what I want to do, any more. The fiancee (we're getting married in December), wants me to just get a car because she doesn't think I need a truck. Obviously, once I'm married I'll have a extra person to pay for, so maybe I'll have to do that.

I dunno gentlemen. Your advice though has helped, but I just don't know what I'm going to do. *sigh* I just know I don't want to put around in the Ranger, that is slow, and small.

JyRO

I tell ya what I'd do in your position. Keep the Ranger, I think you're not going to get squat enough for it anyway, might as well keep it. Then do a search for a good used diesel Jetta 5 speed.

Those cars sound cool, get around real quick and easy, can get in the mid-50's for mpg, and your future missus will not have anything to edit about. But don't let her take it to the gas station ... it will wind up getting gas put in it sooner or later. Take it to the diesel pumps yourself and tell the Cummins guys how cool their trucks are, and the 6.0hno guys how you're getting 55 mpg.

Then the Ranger can be used for light to maybe medium truck work. And part of the money you can save (on fuel costs & not laying out as much money as you would for a good 2nd gen truck), can be used to keep the Ranger as reliable as you care to keep it.

Your outlay for the used Jetta is going to be less than a good 2nd gen Cummins. And you'll still get a grin on your face listening to a diesel Jetta crank up, and when you roll up to the gas station with 700+ miles on a 15 or so gallon tank.

If it were cost effective for me to sell my '04 Corolla and walk into a early 2000's Jetta diesel, I would have already done it.

- JyRO

supr

Unless you need the truck(diesel) to haul a load, the economic justification is simply not there.
Car wise, it is hard to beat an Accord, camry, Altima, Rx6 4 banger. They do not costs as much as a diesel. VW reliability has not been great according to Consumer report. The gasers get 30+ highway(depending on speed) 20-25 arounfd town. Low maitenance.
Civic, Corrola, Sentra all get 33-35 hwy, 25 -28 city. Also good choices.
Truck wise, tacomma, 4 runner, frontier, Xterra will do well on maitenence, but mileage WILL be less, 17-23 overall.
Life is comprises. get a 3 year old Accord, rebuild the ranger. 20 Mpg is not bad on a truck. Most 6's get 16-19.
When you can afford it, get the Cummins cause it is cool. Lots of guys on this site do.
Good luck!!

Grit Dog

If you need a pickup and the Ranger is going to die, my suggestion for a reasonable priced solid truck would be a '90's model GM 1500. Preferrably a stick shift. Had several of those from 2-1990 models and 2-1997 models and they were all bulletproof. Driving them easy (4x4 models) would get 16-17mpg on the highway. My first 1990, I bought w/ 70k on the clock, sold at 160k mi and saw the truck when it was at 220k mi and it was still on all original drivetrain. When I owned it, I only had a few minor problems, clutch at 100k (expected), rear wheel cyl's, master cyl, and alternator (all at about 100k).

FATCAT

I have the perfect answer for you. Buy what you WANT. If you want the big truck, get it. If it makes you happy ... thats all that matters.

Also, I love my Jetta 5-speed. It get great milage, AND its fun to drive. Not as fast as a gasser, but when your up to speed and need to pass the torque kicks in real well.

Anyway, life is short, drive what you want. Whats a few bucks more a week if your happy.

JyRO

I certainly cannot agree with that. I'd love to have an H1. It would make me happy. That is until I started resenting how much money it was costing me, and how I couldn't take my little buddies to McDonalds because we had no money. Or I couldn't pay for little league baseball, etc. etc. etc.

I agree with driving what you want, to a degree. I think you have to consider the long term situation, and be realistic.

I feel that I'm more than lucky. I'm blessed. I have a reliable cheap commuter car (Corolla) that get's 39 mpg. And it's enjoyable to drive because it's a 5 speed. I have a truck that can do anything. Haul people, haul lumber, drywall, etc. It can tow anything within reason. AND, it gets darn good fuel mileage to boot. I have a nice minivan that hauls the family in style ... and the wife is content to drive it. I've got all the bases covered. But it has taken some dedication, and discipline to get what I've got.

Personally I think the guy would save himself some money, not wind up with the frustration you'd have with just one big truck alone, and enjoy driving a mid-size sedan, if he kept the truck he has, and add a used Jetta diesel in there. His truck sounds like it's doing a respectable job ... just maybe needs some tranny work.

- JyRO

supercharged_hp

There's another thing that bugs me about buying "fuel miser" type vehicles, especially trucks. I used to have 2000 Tacoma 4x4 with a 3.4L V6 and 5 speed in high school. I bought it thinking it'd be fun off road and be good on fuel but the **** thing got aweful mileage, like 14-15mpg overall. The same thing as my buddy who got a 2003 Ranger FX4 V6, it gets low teens in MPG. They have inefficient engines and are geared too short to try to make them feel powerful.

When I graduated I sold the Taco and I picked up my 2004 Dodge 1500 5.7L. It weighs far more than the Tacoma (5000lbs), is way bigger, is way less aerodynamic and has twice as much power. Yet the truck still averages 16-17 mpg because the engine is efficient and it has a 5 speed auto that keeps the revs low. My buddy picked up a RCSB Dodge 4x4 with MDS and his is even better. Even my cousin's SRT-10 RCSB with the 505ci Viper V-10 gets better mileage than my old Tacoma lol, it's because he keeps the revs low and it has a tall 6th gear for the highway.

wcbcruzer

I'm surprised to hear that a midsize Toyota was less fuel efficient than a full-size truck. Maybe you had big wheels on it? Although I do believe you, my friend right now has a 03 Tundra V6 and he gets about 19 mpg highway. It's just the nature of the beast.