pwabbott

See this article in the January 2003 Issue of "Trailer Life. Here are some excerpts:

"This time around, we had more time behind the wheel at a more-extensive media launch event, and we were able to saddle up with an Alfa Leisure 35-foot Model 274 35RLTKBS fifth-wheel that weighs about 14,500 pounds. Our test truck was the two-wheel-drive (2WD) Ram 3500 standard cab with the 4.10 axle and a hefty 16,000-pound tow rating.
A few 6- to 7-percent grades along California's Highway 101 gave us some serious tests of the truck's muscle."

"A revised engine feature, called an All-Speed Governor, eliminates a major problem associated with driv-ing a manual-box tow rig: Starting from a dead stop without destroying the clutch, lugging the engine or jerking the combo. In effect, the engine fea-ture is a low-speed governor Most diesel drivers are familiar with a top-end governor that limits engine speed in order to avoid engine damage due to ex-cess rpm. The new Cummins feature does just the opposite. If the engine is under load and its running speed starts to drop below its standard no load idle speed, the low-speed governor increas-es fuel delivery to bring the engine back up to its desired rpm."

" An all-new hydroformed frame, rack-and-pinion steering and redesigned suspension contribute to the new Ram's roadworthiness. The rear springs are three inches longer than last year's and are spaced wider; which, according to Dodge, eliminates the need for a sta-bilizer or anti-sway bar. New front-sus-pension geometry helps maintain align-ment throughout the range of suspension travel, and four-wheel disc brakes lend a confidence to braking that's wel-come with a large trailer out back."

' We can verify that the Ram 3500's ride was as good as any we've experienced with a dualie truck. Solo, it's a decent ride, since the springs are softer than last year's, but an overload spring is there to engage and handle the load when need-ed. Towing, the trailer felt secure and in control. There was no aft-end cornering squishiness, which can occur with a big, heavy trailer along for the ride."

' All of a sudden, it's fun again to tow with a manual transmission. Once rolling, the tranny's gear spread seems very well matched to the engine's power output. Under hard acceleration, up and down hills or in-town driving with frequent speed changes, there was always a gear that was right for the job. None of the gear spreads were broad enough to produce power-robbing en-gine-rpm changes during a shift under high-throttle conditions."

" The new Ram 3500 with the HO Cummins is a terrific step up in heavy-duty civilized performance for drivers living outside of California. The power and performance war is heating up be-tween the Big Three manufacturers, and Dodge's latest salvo should keep the Ram at the forefront in the battle for the heavy-towing buyer. TL"

Lots more is said regarding towing with the 2003. It is a must read for the towing crowd.

CTDCAL

Phil,<br><br>Good article, I did not know about the Low Speed Gov, and this is my first CTD so I was wonder why it did that. I have noticed it function when starting out by letting the clutch out slowly without giving it any throttle, it will automatically come up without lugging. Pretty cool!!!!!!!!!!!<br><br>Take care and Merry Christmas to all<br><br>CTDCAL

Push Rod

[quote author=Sierra Phil link=board=17;threadid=8518;start=0#82188 date=1040275311]
&quot;A revised engine feature, called an All-Speed Governor, eliminates a major problem associated with driv-ing a manual-
[/quote]

Their All-Speed Governor apparently wasn't tested in icy conditions. If you grab a foot full of throttle, feel the tires slip, and get off the throttle hard, the truck apparently feels that it needs to govern, and pours the fuel to it. Its not a nice feeling to get off the throttle because you're starting to kick sideways a bit, only to have the truck decide it wants to :-)

I can attest to the low-end grunt of the truck though. Early this morning (5am, yech), I had a 10K load of sheep to haul over to a drop-off point for rail grading. I picked up something on the road, and had a double blowout on the trailer. If it hadn't been for the noise, I never would have noticed. The truck didn't pull down, the RPMs never even fluttered.

Rod

Mopar_Mudder

It was icey here the other night, I was gettin into it just to slide the dually around and see how it felt, I never noticed any of what you descrided. The second I backout out of the throttle she came right back......

UTAH

Rod - I've also not experienced throttle problems in ice and snow. Do you mean the RPMs come up to set idle when you back off? Or, do the RPMs rise or hold ABOVE set idle? (which it should not be doing)

I recall another member here stating their RPMs would rise (rather than drop) between shifts making the truck surge on it's own.

On my old CTD's ('96 and '98) without the new feature, the RPMs would drop so fast between shifts you could actually hear the turbine stall. These new engines still drop RPMs between shifts, they just don't drop 'em as fast as they used to.

Boys, if your trucks are rising above set idle* on their own
and RPMs are not dropping between shifts, then please get 'em checked out - sounds dangerous to me.

* It's O.K. if it kicks up RPMs when the engine is cold and left to idle - but that feature should kick off as soon as you start moving.

Best to y'all
Bill

Push Rod

The way I get it to happen is by grabbing a healthy chunk of throttle (say about 1/2) while rolling at about 10 - 20 mph, and as soon as the tires start to spin, I immediately back right off the throttle. If you watch the RPMs, they'll drop below 750, and then take a quick hike up to 1100, and then settle back down again. If you grab some clutch, they'll drop immediately. And if you aren't aggressive on the throttle, it's also well behaved. Slowly pressing the go-pedal until breaking traction, and then backing out won't trigger the governor, either.

Lugging the truck down on ice is also bad news. Let the RPMs drop below 750, they'll immediately kick up to 850, and once the tires slip, I've had it come up to 1100 rpm. Again, grabbing a foot full of clutch gets them back down.

I think whats happening is that the truck is sensing a below idle speed condition, compensates for it, but is overcompensating on ice. The truck is well behaved on dry pavement. Lug it down below idle, and it'll immediately respond by pulling you to 750 - 850 rpms.

It'll also take effect in a red-line shift situation. Power shifting at 3200 RPMs will often see the revs shoot to 3600 before backing down.

I've been talking to Mark Chapple about this phenomenon, which is more prevalent in cooler temperatures. They're having such a time of it with their test truck and test TST box, that they are considering doing some programming changes on the box to compensate. Cummins in Indiana has a buy-back truck out of Texas, and are trying to figure out whats causing it. Its very funky. I've driven a couple other trucks on the Chrysler lot, and one would behave exactly as my truck does, and the other one was well-mannered. And it doesn't appear to matter if its a SO or HO.

Rod

FiverBob

I sure don't know what ice is doing on the road? Did an ice truck have an accident. Boy are you guys reminding me why I like Florida.<br><br>I was very impressed with the feature of this idle. I tried the &quot;let out the clutch with no fuel&quot; routine with the fiver (16000#) on. I could take off in first with no throttle. Backing it in was clutch and brake only, no throttle. Pretty neat. I was wondering what backing would be like with the stick, but I was pleasantly surprised. I pictured a little bit of fancy footwork going on, but no such thing. I like it. 8)<br><br>Bob

Push Rod

[quote author=FiverBob link=board=17;threadid=8518;start=0#82410 date=1040329943]
I sure don't know what ice is doing on the road?
[/quote]

Scotty let his Penguins out again, and they ain't potty trained :'( now I will have to wash all those dresses on those sheep again!

Actually, I am a little confused by the hoopla of this 'new feature'. While they have been a little more aggressive with the fuel, and possibly put a little more thought into it, every Cummins Turbo Diesel that I've ever driven has been low speed governed somewhat. If you dumped the clutch, you could kill the truck, but gently releasing the clutch with a 12K or 14K load, the truck would usually walk right off with it.

Rod

Hunter

I am glad someone started this thread!<br><br>I have just finished my sentence of pulling the RV around at 50MPH or under for about 500 miles.<br><br>During this time, I have put her up to redline etc. and speed shifted some. <br><br>What I am noticing is this, if I am burning along under full load at about say 2500-2900 RPM and suddenly take my foot off the throttle it seems to just totally bottom out! Like CLUNK! you ran out of fuel<br><br>Anyone else noticing this?<br><br>Totally drops out of there to nowhere, especially on an incline<br><br>Hunter

Mopar_Mudder

Well if you take your foot off the gas it is going to totally drop off. I think we need some more detail or something.

pwabbott

The Low-Speed Governor will only maintain the idle speed if placed under load. It does this with your foot off the throttle. It would not cause the engine to speed up on Ice as in that situation there would be a no-load condition.

Scotty

I better chime in here and try to explain what I felt when I was driving Rods truck. While in gear and letting off the throttle on several occasion on dry roads it did accelerate.<br>Its like it surged then dropped right off.<br>I also noticed that when I let off the pedal and then put the clutch in it would also rise a couple hundred RPM but not all the time then almost instantly drop to idle.<br>Once on the highway I was about to accelerate and pull out and pass a car...I gently tapped the throttle and then let off as another car was going to pass me. It gave a surge and then dropped off. Maybe this is TPS or ECM or?

Push Rod

[quote author=Sierra Phil link=board=17;threadid=8518;start=0#82565 date=1040349321]<br>The Low-Speed Governor will only maintain the idle speed if placed under load. It does this with your foot off the throttle. It would not cause the engine to speed up on Ice as in that situation there would be a no-load condition.<br>[/quote]<br><br>Their idea of a load condition is simply dropping below idle while the vehicle is moving or beginning to move (ie: lugging the engine) They need to revisit the programming on this feature. It applies to much fuel when the RPMs drop below idle, and with the power of the truck, it breaks the rear wheels loose. And apparently only on certain trucks. ???<br><br>Rod

Jim O

Push Rod My truck does that as well. And I also noticed when pulling heavy with the trailer if you shift at say 2900 it will rev up to 3000 and my foot is off of the accellerator. Another thing I have noticed if you come around a corner in third and get on it when it hits 1400 if it is at all icey or even just wet pavement it will wipe it's feet and when you back off it waits just a little while longer ( 1/2 a second or so of more throttle than you want). But I would rather complain about more power than not enough.<br>Jim O

Push Rod

[quote author=Jim O link=board=17;threadid=8518;start=0#82922 date=1040421686]<br>than you want). But I would rather complain about more power than not enough.<br>[/quote]<br><br> Oh yeah, don't get me wrong. Its not like its a bad problem to deal with, having too much power. Its taken me by surprise a couple times, though. In Edmonton, I grabbed a foot full of throttle, and when the rear tires lit up, I backed off. Then the governor threw more fuel at it just as I hit dry pavement. the Toyota in front of me probably saw nothing but grill <br><br>And when I was talking to Mark Chapple about the TST prototype, he started to laugh and then asked how I'd feel if the truck did that with another 80 - 100 HP at the wheels. I guess its taken him by surprise a couple times too. <br><br>Rod