In the shop with less than 1000 miles...
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Here's the new update: Faulty ECM. Just got off the phone with the service manager and his tech diagnosed a faulty ECM, then called DC to back it up. DC instructed him to do a bunch more tests-they can't believe it's an ECM...which won't be finished until mid morning tomorrow. At that point, if it is an ECM, it will take 3-5 working days to get one. Basically it looks like it's going to be in there for roughly a week.
Seems to me that they're wandering blindly on this one. If it was an ECM, why wasn't it diagnosed yesterday? I hate "throw another part at it" troubleshooting. I see it all the time with the young airmen and petty officers working on our tactical jets here. They use it as a crutch because they have no diagnostic skills...especially on the new jets like the F/A-18. They just look at the codes and start replacing boxes...sometimes without seeing the bigger picture.
Seems to me that they're wandering blindly on this one. If it was an ECM, why wasn't it diagnosed yesterday? I hate "throw another part at it" troubleshooting. I see it all the time with the young airmen and petty officers working on our tactical jets here. They use it as a crutch because they have no diagnostic skills...especially on the new jets like the F/A-18. They just look at the codes and start replacing boxes...sometimes without seeing the bigger picture.
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From: Mass
Here I thought I might get lucky since my truck was built on the 14th of June and had Rev A put in it from the factory...but here's what happened...
On the way home from the dealer, the truck had two fits of a shuddering bucking vibration. Once for about 5 seconds, the second for about 10 sec. I got the truck home, went on travel for work for about 2 weeks and have been driving it back and forth to work, 45mph or less about 10 miles one way for the last two weeks.
So on Friday I embark on about a 400 mile roundtrip to deliver a bed for a buddy. On the way there with 750 miles on the odo, it starts the same bucking and shuddering fit as before...except this time it lasts about 20 seconds and throws the CEL and the ETC light. I look it up in the manual, and since the ETC light was steady and not flashing I went on my way to my buddy's area and went straight to the dealer in Visalia about an hour before they closed. They pulled the codes and told me not to drive it, with a p0608 and a p0206 code.
First thing Sat morning, the tech called STAR, and they instructed him to reflash some software. There was a TSB on the p0608 code (low line pressure in the trans), so the TCM got a reflash and the p0206 code (open circuit to the #6 injector) got some sort of flash as well. STAR then told the tech that it would need to be driven. It was running smoothly and so I take it about 30 miles and stop to do some shopping. As I stop, the engine is running rough at idle like an older 12V so I turn it off and restart it. It runs for about 4 seconds and then dies. Then I try to restart it and it will crank, but not start. I call the dealer back and while they're figuring out a tow truck, I thought what the hell, I'll try it again. So roughly ten minutes later I try to start it and it fires up, running smoothly with a CEL. I take it back to the dealer, late in the day again and they pull the codes, this time the p0206 code again. They clear the code and unfortunately couldn't get me a rental car that late in the day. Since I have to be at work bright and early Monday morning, staying until Monday morning to get a rental car wasn't an option. Since it was once again running smoothly, they said it was safe to drive back the 200 miles.
I left this afternoon to drive back, got into the desert mountains, and it starts having a fit again...throws the CEL and this time it lasts for about 10 minutes...limping along at 50mph, with the ETC light on. It cleared up and ran smoothly for a while...then launched into another fit for about another 10 minutes, vibrating and shuddering like crazy as it ran on 5 cylinders. Then it cleared up for the rest of the drive home. I drove it straight to the local dealer here that I honestly don't have a lot of faith in after they way they "fixed" my '02 Dakota that I owned previously. They were of course closed on Sunday, so I'll call them first thing in the morning.
Any ideas? The tech at the Visalia dealership said that he'd need to tear into the engine to see what the deal was with the #6 injector. He also said that the injectors were a restricted item, meaning that he'd need authorization from DC to get another if that was the problem...sounds to me like the truck will be in the shop for the better part of a week. Anyone know what the regs are on a loaner or a rental car?
On the way home from the dealer, the truck had two fits of a shuddering bucking vibration. Once for about 5 seconds, the second for about 10 sec. I got the truck home, went on travel for work for about 2 weeks and have been driving it back and forth to work, 45mph or less about 10 miles one way for the last two weeks.
So on Friday I embark on about a 400 mile roundtrip to deliver a bed for a buddy. On the way there with 750 miles on the odo, it starts the same bucking and shuddering fit as before...except this time it lasts about 20 seconds and throws the CEL and the ETC light. I look it up in the manual, and since the ETC light was steady and not flashing I went on my way to my buddy's area and went straight to the dealer in Visalia about an hour before they closed. They pulled the codes and told me not to drive it, with a p0608 and a p0206 code.
First thing Sat morning, the tech called STAR, and they instructed him to reflash some software. There was a TSB on the p0608 code (low line pressure in the trans), so the TCM got a reflash and the p0206 code (open circuit to the #6 injector) got some sort of flash as well. STAR then told the tech that it would need to be driven. It was running smoothly and so I take it about 30 miles and stop to do some shopping. As I stop, the engine is running rough at idle like an older 12V so I turn it off and restart it. It runs for about 4 seconds and then dies. Then I try to restart it and it will crank, but not start. I call the dealer back and while they're figuring out a tow truck, I thought what the hell, I'll try it again. So roughly ten minutes later I try to start it and it fires up, running smoothly with a CEL. I take it back to the dealer, late in the day again and they pull the codes, this time the p0206 code again. They clear the code and unfortunately couldn't get me a rental car that late in the day. Since I have to be at work bright and early Monday morning, staying until Monday morning to get a rental car wasn't an option. Since it was once again running smoothly, they said it was safe to drive back the 200 miles.
I left this afternoon to drive back, got into the desert mountains, and it starts having a fit again...throws the CEL and this time it lasts for about 10 minutes...limping along at 50mph, with the ETC light on. It cleared up and ran smoothly for a while...then launched into another fit for about another 10 minutes, vibrating and shuddering like crazy as it ran on 5 cylinders. Then it cleared up for the rest of the drive home. I drove it straight to the local dealer here that I honestly don't have a lot of faith in after they way they "fixed" my '02 Dakota that I owned previously. They were of course closed on Sunday, so I'll call them first thing in the morning.
Any ideas? The tech at the Visalia dealership said that he'd need to tear into the engine to see what the deal was with the #6 injector. He also said that the injectors were a restricted item, meaning that he'd need authorization from DC to get another if that was the problem...sounds to me like the truck will be in the shop for the better part of a week. Anyone know what the regs are on a loaner or a rental car?
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Here's the new update: Faulty ECM. Just got off the phone with the service manager and his tech diagnosed a faulty ECM, then called DC to back it up. DC instructed him to do a bunch more tests-they can't believe it's an ECM...which won't be finished until mid morning tomorrow. At that point, if it is an ECM, it will take 3-5 working days to get one. Basically it looks like it's going to be in there for roughly a week.
Seems to me that they're wandering blindly on this one. If it was an ECM, why wasn't it diagnosed yesterday? I hate "throw another part at it" troubleshooting. I see it all the time with the young airmen and petty officers working on our tactical jets here. They use it as a crutch because they have no diagnostic skills...especially on the new jets like the F/A-18. They just look at the codes and start replacing boxes...sometimes without seeing the bigger picture.
Seems to me that they're wandering blindly on this one. If it was an ECM, why wasn't it diagnosed yesterday? I hate "throw another part at it" troubleshooting. I see it all the time with the young airmen and petty officers working on our tactical jets here. They use it as a crutch because they have no diagnostic skills...especially on the new jets like the F/A-18. They just look at the codes and start replacing boxes...sometimes without seeing the bigger picture.
).
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From: Rochester, NY
My dad had a 99 Lemon. Upgraded to a 1ton 4wd 6 speed HO and has NEVER looked back. Hands down best vehicle anyone in my family has ever owned. A lemon is a lemon, which sucks in itself, however not every truck is a lemon and you obviously chose your truck for a reason. I'd say order/find a new one if it's a lemon and put this truck behind you.
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Had a bit of a bright spot this morning...the truck sales manager at the dealer that I bought the truck from in Vegas called me and said he'd heard of the problems with my truck (I'd called and talked to two of his sales people earlier), asked what the problem was and basically said that if I wasn't happy with the service at the dealer here in town, to let him know and he'd send out a wrecker to pick up my truck and take it back to Vegas to let his dealership work it over (3.5 hour drive one way) I was pretty impressed with that. We'll see how it turns out today with the dealer here in town.
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Had a bit of a bright spot this morning...the truck sales manager at the dealer that I bought the truck from in Vegas called me and said he'd heard of the problems with my truck (I'd called and talked to two of his sales people earlier), asked what the problem was and basically said that if I wasn't happy with the service at the dealer here in town, to let him know and he'd send out a wrecker to pick up my truck and take it back to Vegas to let his dealership work it over (3.5 hour drive one way) I was pretty impressed with that. We'll see how it turns out today with the dealer here in town.
HOpe you get her worked out bro.
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From: St. Augustine, FL
OneTon, it sounds like the Vegas dealer wants to make it right with you. I would see if the new ECM works, if not I would tell the Vegas dealer to please pick it up and have a last shot at it. I would also let them know that it is a LAST chance to fix it right before you start proceeding with Lemon Lawing it.
btw. I would still get another Cummins. Just my $0.02
Good luck
btw. I would still get another Cummins. Just my $0.02
Good luck
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Here's some of the latest. When it wouldn't start and had to be towed, the codes they pulled were p0607 (ECM internal fault) and p0206 again (open #6 injector circuit) After more troubleshooting with DC today, DC instructed them to replace the valve cover gasket (apparently it contains wires to the injectors). The part's in Los Angeles, but it takes them 3 days to get it up here. This I don't understand because LA is only a 2.5 hour drive away. I'm somewhat satisfied that the VC gasket would fix the p0206 code, but have no confidence in the fix for the ECM, or even that there is one. I'm also a little peeved that they don't get an ECM while they're at it so it's standing by ready to be installed. Otherwise I'll get to wait another 3-5 days while they order it...I'm starting to think I should just get it taken to Las Vegas. It's looking like I'm off to a good start in fufilling the lemon law 30 day in the shop requirement.
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From: Indiana
The worst part is, the ecm is on restriction. That means they can't just order it. They have to call the STAR tech line to get approval to order it. That usually entails a lot of diagnostics that I am guessing is what led to the valve cover gasket/wiring replacement. That being faulty may have set the ecm fault code. Won't know for sure without fixing the wiring first. Good luck. I don't think they are yanking your chain though.
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I went down and talked to the guys after I got off duty today. Honestly I have to backpedal a bit about what I said about their troubleshooting skills. They're good dudes, but their hands are tied by STAR and the parts being restricted. They too would love to order an ECM right along with the gasket, but since it's restricted, they can't. They too couldn't understand how the new gasket would cure future ECM faults, but VZdude, it sounds like you know, so that makes me feel better. The frustrating thing is that although the parts warehouse is only 2 hours away, it takes a full three days to get the part. They ordered the gasket today...which means it's here on Friday. I'm leaving Friday to go to an airshow in Canada, and won't be back until Monday. That leaves me with a week to thoroughly test it before I leave on travel again. I've already decided if it breaks down again after this VC gasket fix I'm having it towed to Vegas and they can monkey with it while I'm gone for two weeks.
The techs at the dealership in town were in full agreement with me about this having a lot of potential as a lemon case. Hopefully the VC gasket fixes it.
The techs at the dealership in town were in full agreement with me about this having a lot of potential as a lemon case. Hopefully the VC gasket fixes it.
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Ok gents, I picked the truck up yesterday after they replaced the VC gasket. The took it on a 40 mile test drive, had no problems and released it to me. I've just driven it around town so far...no problems. I'll be taking about a 3 hour round trip tomorrow to further test it. Also, I'd like to go on the record and say I've changed my mind about Diamond Motors in Ridgecrest CA. The techs are good people, they're just hamstringed by the DC techline and the fact that they are at the end of the supply food chain.
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From: Indiana
^ Great to hear! Hopefully the ECM code was just an erroneous code set by the faulty wiring in the VC gasket. If not, you'll know soon enough!
I went down the "STAR" road many times trying to get them to get me a part that I feared being faulty along with another "they" thought was faulty. End result was about a 50% right/wrong rate. We joked, at the dealership I worked at, about hearing the wheel spinngin in the background while the STAR guy was trying to figure out what was wrong. Kinda like a wheel of fortune! Anyhow, hope it's the last trip to the dealer for a while for you!
I went down the "STAR" road many times trying to get them to get me a part that I feared being faulty along with another "they" thought was faulty. End result was about a 50% right/wrong rate. We joked, at the dealership I worked at, about hearing the wheel spinngin in the background while the STAR guy was trying to figure out what was wrong. Kinda like a wheel of fortune! Anyhow, hope it's the last trip to the dealer for a while for you!
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vzdude, thanks for helping us 6.7 guniea pigs out...
I am at 1,200 near perfect miles so far. Bought truck 7/13 already flashed is prolly why...
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