Okay, I am a poor old dumb crountry boy that needs to lower exhaust gas temperatures, without a loss of power.

I have read and re-read every post I could find on water/methane injection.

Now I am super confused, more so than I was before reading anything.

I tow heavy, really really heavy.

I would like a system that I can flip a switch, when I see a big hill approaching, and not get a big drive-shaft bending lunge.

Added power on the grade would be nice, but lower EGT is my main aim.

I would, most likely, flip the switch off, once the hill is conquered.

Is such a system available; and, in plain old country boy language, what would such a system consist of??

I would be totally lost, if I had to fool with some kind of computer to accomplish the setting of controls, or whatever.

Please excuse my ignorance and point me in the right direction.

Thanks.

 

I was going to bring up the "latent heat of vaporization arguement, but looks like you beat me to it Dave (a long time ago!)

Water actually has one of the highest LHV of any liquid ()
and promotes a slower more even flame propogation in a gasoline engine due in part to the cooling before ignition and during ignition.

Being that a diesel is a compression cycle engine that relies solely of the heat of compression and recycled heat from previous cumbustion cycles I would think that the methanol (or ethanol) makes up for any heat loss and then some.

I'm thinking out loud here, but I gotta say that a diesel is a strange bird, and doesn't much correlate to a gasoline engine. Gassers make total sense to me, and I can usually predict what happens and why. But having a wide open inlet all the time and controlling the engine with fuel only freaks me out. In a gasser that would cause an extremely lean condition that would burn holes in all the pistons, but a diesel can run at 100:1 scoiciometric and not melt at all. I don't get it. I know I have chased this rabbit before and I apologize.

So for me trying to figure out how much alcohol to add in a water injection system can be nothing but trial and error or an educated guess based on previous knowlege (mine and or all of yours).....

I'm sorry for this post

 

Well i'm not shore that i can help but i will try. hopfully dave will come in and clarify my statment!


I now that there is a defalt setting that will put you in a power save setting that you dont ever have to touch,if you dont want!
all that would req is that you follow the instruction to install it!

with this defalt, or maybe i could call it the factory setting,it wouldn't come on untill you were heavy with the right foot and egt were a climbing. In ether word there wouldn't be any swith that you would have to turn on or off it would do it all by its self, when you needed it most, and when you cleared the top of the hill and started to go down. It would shut its self off and wate tell the next one came a long all with out you having to do a thing!

thats how my understanding of the coolmist system works!hopefully Dave or.....dave or one of the ether sharper pencle will chime in

 

BearKiller,

Flash pretty much nailed it.

The Coolingmist controller comes with default (factory) settings so you can just plug it in and run it. Hooking it to a computer is entirely optional for those who want to tweak the factory settings a little.

By your description, it sounds as if you want a dual stage pressure activated setup. The pressure activated systems use a boost/pressure switch to activate the system (and two for a dual stage system). They are quite a bit cheaper, however the Coolingmist Vari-Cool controller is actually MUCH easier and simpler to install. A dual stage pressure activated system gets pretty complicated to install when it comes to wiring dual solenoids, relays, and pressure switches. If this is a concern I would seriously consider just going with the variable controller.

EDIT TO ADD: Also, once you feel the added power you won't be turning it off...I promise you!

 

So just what dus it talke to wire up the variable controller? compaired to the old one,... dual pressure setup!

 

The controller only has 4 wires to hook up. 1 is switched 12v power, 1 is a ground, and the other 2 are the positive and negative wires that go to the pump. You have to run a boost line to the controller too. I just T'ed off my existing boost gauge line since it was already in the cab.

I've never installed a dual-stage pressure activated system before, but you would need to wire 2 solenoids, 2 relays (I think), and 2 pressure switches in addition to the pump and arm/disarm switch wiring. Wiring those relays is definitely not much fun.

 

Ya that sound way easer the wire up then the duel stage way!

so you can do some fine tuning with out the lap top....right?
with some nobbes?

 

Yeah, you can adjust the minimum boost (when the system kicks-in) and the maximum boost (when the system maxes out). Both the min and max settings are adjustable from 1-30psi. To turn the system off you turn the max lower than the min. It didn't come with an arm/disarm switch because of this feature, but I think I want one anyway in case it "wacked-out" and went to max while at idle.

The duty cycle of the pump (ie. the overall pressure) can also be ajusted using a 3rd **** called "Tune". Using the laptop with it isn't absolutely necessary, but I would strongly recommend you do at some point. The only reason is to change the pump minimum duty cycle (when it kicks-on) from the default of 25% to at least 40%.

If you do the math, with a large dual nozzle system and 150psi pump, the nozzles are not even close to atomizing properly when the pump kicks-on at 25% (assuming 15-20psi of boost at the time).

 

Thanks! When i get to that point i'll pick your brain a little more!

 

Np...anytime, Flash!


To the guys currently running W/M: Do you think relative humidity could have any noticeable effect on the amount of w/m that can be injected? I just starting thinking about it and maybe in 80% humidity one can only inject say 20gph total, when in 10% humidity the same person could inject more (like 25gph)?

 

I don't pretend to have a clue about the math, but I would think, at least initially, the relative humidity would impact performance if only to a small degree.

If the ambient air relative humidity is 100%, then changing nothing, you can't evaporate water as the air is already 100% saturated. Keep in mind, we're talking ambient air.
Now you start compressing (raising absolute pressure which ultimately raises the heat concentration plus a little), then after-cooling (which not only cools the air, but changes its density, etc) . . . . . . and then you wanna add some what!?


Getting to your question, you can inject all you want, the question is though, how much is actually evaporated (therefore absorbing heat)?

 

Bearkiller - If you want something smooth that you can turn on and off manually, then either the Coolingmist controller or the Snow controller will work fine. You just turn the system on and off as you feel lit is needed, and the progressive controller will keep it smooth. This is assuming you don't flick the switch on under conditions that would call for full injection, of course. You'd have to turn it on before the hill.

If you want it automatic, Snow makes a controller that looks at both boost and EGT when determining whether to spray. For example, it can be set up so that the water meth starts at 15 psi, but only if EGT is over 1100 degrees. According to Coolingmist's website they have a similar controller in the works.

 

It doesn't matter when you are injecting it so close to the intake valves. There just isn't enough time for the stuff to vaporize a whole lot before it hits the combustion chamber.

If one were to inject it upstream (like right after the turbo) then the relative humidity would matter more.

Anyone studied the difference between injecting right into the inlet horn rather than right after the turbo outlet?

 

I think the general concensus is that injecting anywhere before the intercooler (assuming you have one) is a bad idea. The spray could condense and puddle in the bottom of the IC and it would be corrosive.

However, from what I've read you should be injecting as far from the intake manifold as possible to help with the vaporization/heat absorption. That's the main reason I installed my 2nd nozzle in the intake piping well before the intake horn.

EDIT: Also, is your statement that it makes no difference based on facts and testing or your own opinion/theory? Not questioning you, just curious.

 

Based a little on testing (gasser) and the rest extrapilation (guessing).