Steering Box Brace Question
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,918
Likes: 603
From: Tulsa, OK
Yah I was thinking about that. I've seen a pic of one that cracked right below the factory weld on the cross piece. It's pretty flimsy there so I was gonna brace it. If it doesn't hold up I'll know better for next time! On one of the other forums there is (or was) a member named Mysteryman. He claimed to be an engineer for Chrysler that worked on the 1st gen Cummins truck design team. He had a pretty vague post about why you shouldn't weld a 1st gen frame because it was made of a hardened steel and you would weaken it and cause it to crack. I was curious if anything similar would surface regarding the steering box brace.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,479
Likes: 211
From: Isanti, MN
Yah I was thinking about that. I've seen a pic of one that cracked right below the factory weld on the cross piece. It's pretty flimsy there so I was gonna brace it. If it doesn't hold up I'll know better for next time! On one of the other forums there is (or was) a member named Mysteryman. He claimed to be an engineer for Chrysler that worked on the 1st gen Cummins truck design team. He had a pretty vague post about why you shouldn't weld a 1st gen frame because it was made of a hardened steel and you would weaken it and cause it to crack. I was curious if anything similar would surface regarding the steering box brace.
Mysteryman was one of the 1st gen Cummins engineers.
Terry called me and we had a LONG chat one day.
One of the things I mentioned was building a 6 BT Ramcharger.
He said the best thing to do would be get a '89-'91 7 inch framed Cummins truck and chop out a length of the frame and fish plate it.
He said the Ramchargers frame was a thinner metal for the actually C channel on the frame and would be a weak link.
Check out the way my RC, Moonshine was done for a better picture.
Long story, but if that is what he told be, then he must be ok with welding on the old frames.
Great guy to talk with, but like you said, he can me a little mysterious...
Terry called me and we had a LONG chat one day.
One of the things I mentioned was building a 6 BT Ramcharger.
He said the best thing to do would be get a '89-'91 7 inch framed Cummins truck and chop out a length of the frame and fish plate it.
He said the Ramchargers frame was a thinner metal for the actually C channel on the frame and would be a weak link.
Check out the way my RC, Moonshine was done for a better picture.
Long story, but if that is what he told be, then he must be ok with welding on the old frames.
Great guy to talk with, but like you said, he can me a little mysterious...
The trick is:
1. Clean, clean, clean.
2. Prepared weld, ie properly grooved so you can weld it in one pass er side.
3. Low hydrogen rod, fresh out of the rod oven. Also don't even go at it if it's rainy, foggy, etc. I'm not up on the modern stuff, but it probably could be done with the right wire feed material.
4. Grab your chipping hammer and peen the heck out of the weld as soon as it's cool. That relieves the stresses and prevents future under-bead cracking.
This was taught to me by a well driller, not a welding instructor. The driller has to stand under his work, not look down on it.
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,296
Likes: 308
From: PA near Harrisburg
I've welded on this stuff for years. It isn't angle iron mild steel, but it isn't spring steel either.
The trick is:
1. Clean, clean, clean.
2. Prepared weld, ie properly grooved so you can weld it in one pass er side.
3. Low hydrogen rod, fresh out of the rod oven. Also don't even go at it if it's rainy, foggy, etc. I'm not up on the modern stuff, but it probably could be done with the right wire feed material.
4. Grab your chipping hammer and peen the heck out of the weld as soon as it's cool. That relieves the stresses and prevents future under-bead cracking.
This was taught to me by a well driller, not a welding instructor. The driller has to stand under his work, not look down on it.
The trick is:
1. Clean, clean, clean.
2. Prepared weld, ie properly grooved so you can weld it in one pass er side.
3. Low hydrogen rod, fresh out of the rod oven. Also don't even go at it if it's rainy, foggy, etc. I'm not up on the modern stuff, but it probably could be done with the right wire feed material.
4. Grab your chipping hammer and peen the heck out of the weld as soon as it's cool. That relieves the stresses and prevents future under-bead cracking.
This was taught to me by a well driller, not a welding instructor. The driller has to stand under his work, not look down on it.
Registered User
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 223
Likes: 0
From: Susanville, California
That's a good one J! I'd take the advice of a man who has to stand under his welds any day. Good advice about peening. I will probably need to weld in a piece on the bottom of the frame rail where the fuel tank rests against it. It's getting kind of flaky there. I was going to use my ESAB MM250 with ER70S6 wire and 75/25 mix. I have a Miller Thunderbolt AC/DC welder so that gives me some options too.
Lots of good info here
http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/
I have welded my steering gearbox bracket ,( with TIG), and had great results. I have also shortened a frame on a 93 w250 that had previously been lengthened by a company to make it a rollback.
Wow, I was rambling.
Mike
Administrator
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 8,372
Likes: 172
From: Streator Illinois
Mysteryman was one of the 1st gen Cummins engineers.
Terry called me and we had a LONG chat one day.
One of the things I mentioned was building a 6 BT Ramcharger.
He said the best thing to do would be get a '89-'91 7 inch framed Cummins truck and chop out a length of the frame and fish plate it.
He said the Ramchargers frame was a thinner metal for the actually C channel on the frame and would be a weak link.
Terry called me and we had a LONG chat one day.
One of the things I mentioned was building a 6 BT Ramcharger.
He said the best thing to do would be get a '89-'91 7 inch framed Cummins truck and chop out a length of the frame and fish plate it.
He said the Ramchargers frame was a thinner metal for the actually C channel on the frame and would be a weak link.
Let's just say I wouldn't put more than a 4BT on a stock RC frame.
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,918
Likes: 603
From: Tulsa, OK
The thing I try to do when welding a frame is to fishplate after welding the frame. Also, I try to never weld yotaly verticle on a frame. Mig is great if you weld uphill, as you get better penetration that way.
Lots of good info here
http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/
I have welded my steering gearbox bracket ,( with TIG), and had great results. I have also shortened a frame on a 93 w250 that had previously been lengthened by a company to make it a rollback.
Wow, I was rambling.
Mike
Lots of good info here
http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/
I have welded my steering gearbox bracket ,( with TIG), and had great results. I have also shortened a frame on a 93 w250 that had previously been lengthened by a company to make it a rollback.
Wow, I was rambling.
Mike
Registered User
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 223
Likes: 0
From: Susanville, California
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,860
Likes: 425
From: BC
I'm going to use that bolt-on brace for my 2wd RC. Good enough for that purpose.
Keep in mind the RC is 2' shorter wheelbase, and has a full body. Unlikely to have a ton (or 2) of topsoil in the bed for the 6BT to torque against.
I'm not opposed to welding our frames. They need all the help they can get, especially at this age. Even my relatively good-looking 8" frame has significant wasting from rust between the spring hanger and frame channel.
Keep in mind the RC is 2' shorter wheelbase, and has a full body. Unlikely to have a ton (or 2) of topsoil in the bed for the 6BT to torque against.
I'm not opposed to welding our frames. They need all the help they can get, especially at this age. Even my relatively good-looking 8" frame has significant wasting from rust between the spring hanger and frame channel.
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,918
Likes: 603
From: Tulsa, OK
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,296
Likes: 308
From: PA near Harrisburg
Thanks for the advice guys. Thanks for the link Aicomp! Welding tips are always welcome. Good idea with the fish plate for the frame. Dunno what I'm going to do with that until I drop the tank. Looks like drain holes in the frame plugged up and water/salt built up behind the plastic guard between the tank and frame. The inside edge of the frame is getting a bit crumbly. I'll start a new thread on it when I get to fixing it.
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,296
Likes: 308
From: PA near Harrisburg
The thing I try to do when welding a frame is to fishplate after welding the frame. Also, I try to never weld yotaly verticle on a frame. Mig is great if you weld uphill, as you get better penetration that way.
Lots of good info here
http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/
I have welded my steering gearbox bracket ,( with TIG), and had great results. I have also shortened a frame on a 93 w250 that had previously been lengthened by a company to make it a rollback.
Wow, I was rambling.
Mike
Lots of good info here
http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/
I have welded my steering gearbox bracket ,( with TIG), and had great results. I have also shortened a frame on a 93 w250 that had previously been lengthened by a company to make it a rollback.
Wow, I was rambling.
Mike
Registered User
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 223
Likes: 0
From: Susanville, California
I'd love to have a real TIG for precision work. I have one of those chi-com combination plasma cutter-arc-tig machines. I never used anything but the plasma cutter on it though. maybe I'll mess with the TIG but I'm pretty sure I'll be disappointed. Around here real TIG machines that aren't 3 phase are very expensive.
I have two Lincoln TIG machines. My favorite is the V205T 200 amp AC/DC Inverter. I have seen Jody at Welding tips and tricks use a couple of the Chicom TIG machines , and they seem pretty good. I also have used Eastwood's 200 amp inverter Tig with great results. The Eastwood machine is about 7 or 800 dollars.
I have some frame rails here with no rust. If you need a chunk for some splicing, I would just give it to you. Probably be heavy to ship it to you though.
Mike
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,296
Likes: 308
From: PA near Harrisburg
Hi,
I have two Lincoln TIG machines. My favorite is the V205T 200 amp AC/DC Inverter. I have seen Jody at Welding tips and tricks use a couple of the Chicom TIG machines , and they seem pretty good. I also have used Eastwood's 200 amp inverter Tig with great results. The Eastwood machine is about 7 or 800 dollars.
I have some frame rails here with no rust. If you need a chunk for some splicing, I would just give it to you. Probably be heavy to ship it to you though.
Mike
I have two Lincoln TIG machines. My favorite is the V205T 200 amp AC/DC Inverter. I have seen Jody at Welding tips and tricks use a couple of the Chicom TIG machines , and they seem pretty good. I also have used Eastwood's 200 amp inverter Tig with great results. The Eastwood machine is about 7 or 800 dollars.
I have some frame rails here with no rust. If you need a chunk for some splicing, I would just give it to you. Probably be heavy to ship it to you though.
Mike
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,918
Likes: 603
From: Tulsa, OK
Registered User
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 6,838
Likes: 1,683
From: Land of the Toxic Avenger
Hi,
I have two Lincoln TIG machines. My favorite is the V205T 200 amp AC/DC Inverter. I have seen Jody at Welding tips and tricks use a couple of the Chicom TIG machines , and they seem pretty good. I also have used Eastwood's 200 amp inverter Tig with great results. The Eastwood machine is about 7 or 800 dollars.
I have some frame rails here with no rust. If you need a chunk for some splicing, I would just give it to you. Probably be heavy to ship it to you though.
Mike
I have two Lincoln TIG machines. My favorite is the V205T 200 amp AC/DC Inverter. I have seen Jody at Welding tips and tricks use a couple of the Chicom TIG machines , and they seem pretty good. I also have used Eastwood's 200 amp inverter Tig with great results. The Eastwood machine is about 7 or 800 dollars.
I have some frame rails here with no rust. If you need a chunk for some splicing, I would just give it to you. Probably be heavy to ship it to you though.
Mike
PM sent
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Kylemm1002
3rd Generation Ram - Non Drivetrain - All Years
1
Jul 14, 2010 11:56 AM
skindaddy
3rd Generation Ram - Non Drivetrain - All Years
1
Aug 19, 2009 08:51 PM
Performance and Accessories 2nd gen only
6
May 23, 2003 10:04 PM