Fuel in OIL - HELP!
10-09-2017, 05:48 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Fuel in OIL - HELP!
My dipstick shows way over-full and a black oil/fuel mixture is coming out of the overflow tube coming out of the tappet cover at the back of the engine. The return lines are dry as well as the area around them.
Is there any way, other than the front seal of the VE pump for fuel to get in the oil? I'm talking about a major flow. A steady stream out of the crankcase vent.
Edwin
10-09-2017, 05:50 PM
#2
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Front seal of the VE pump OR a torn diaphragm lift pump would be my first two guesses.
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mknittle (10-09-2017)
10-09-2017, 05:52 PM
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My dipstick shows way over-full and a black oil/fuel mixture is coming out of the overflow tube coming out of the tappet cover at the back of the engine. The return lines are dry as well as the area around them.
Is there any way, other than the front seal of the VE pump for fuel to get in the oil? I'm talking about a major flow. A steady stream out of the crankcase vent.
Edwin
I really feel bad for you, Edwin. Not much good luck with the dodge lately...if you lived here, I'd tell ya to bring it on over...
Edit:
Ollie beat me to it
10-09-2017, 05:56 PM
#4
Registered User
You gotta love this place.
4 minutes after posting a problem, you have two answers to the issue.
I agree with T-man, I would start with the LP as it is cheap and easy.
I would also get that oil/fuel mix changed out ASAP!
4 minutes after posting a problem, you have two answers to the issue.
I agree with T-man, I would start with the LP as it is cheap and easy.
I would also get that oil/fuel mix changed out ASAP!
10-09-2017, 06:03 PM
#5
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Thread Starter
I have a piston lift pump which I installed a couple months back when the diaphragm pump quit. Apparently the increased pressure blew the front seal out of the VE.
What's the best way to check the pressure? I don't have a permanent fuel pressure gauge. How do I reduce the pressure? Is there a spring I change in the piston pump?
Edwin
10-09-2017, 06:04 PM
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Lol
The engine internals will be soooooooo clean...
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mknittle (10-09-2017)
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10-09-2017, 06:08 PM
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Yes! I love it when I can post a question and get several answers within 15 minutes.
I have a piston lift pump which I installed a couple months back when the diaphragm pump quit. Apparently the increased pressure blew the front seal out of the VE.
What's the best way to check the pressure? I don't have a permanent fuel pressure gauge. How do I reduce the pressure? Is there a spring I change in the piston pump?
Edwin
I have a piston lift pump which I installed a couple months back when the diaphragm pump quit. Apparently the increased pressure blew the front seal out of the VE.
What's the best way to check the pressure? I don't have a permanent fuel pressure gauge. How do I reduce the pressure? Is there a spring I change in the piston pump?
Edwin
Fitting above the fuel pump is where you can connect a fp gauge. You should have a fp , exh temp, and boost in the truck before any upgrades....
If your VE has never been rebuilt, I'm afraid you may be right.
A defective LP can mimick the issue...
10-09-2017, 06:13 PM
#9
Registered User
I was thinking you might have "upgraded" your LP a while ago, but couldn't remember...
You need to make sure you get a low pressure LP not just a stock 2nd gen one as it will run a pressure with is high enough your front seal on the VE is in jeopardy.
I got a fuel pressure port, basically a Schrader valve, from Geno's installed on my 12Vs and a temporary fuel pressure gauge that I can check any of my trucks if I suspect problems.
The fuel pressure port replaces the banjo bolt on the fuel line from the LP IIRC.
You need to make sure you get a low pressure LP not just a stock 2nd gen one as it will run a pressure with is high enough your front seal on the VE is in jeopardy.
I got a fuel pressure port, basically a Schrader valve, from Geno's installed on my 12Vs and a temporary fuel pressure gauge that I can check any of my trucks if I suspect problems.
The fuel pressure port replaces the banjo bolt on the fuel line from the LP IIRC.
10-09-2017, 06:17 PM
#10
Registered User
There is a spring which you can change in the LP.
Some people here mention getting a spring from Fastenal that worked on the cheap. Or I have seen them offered from the Hungry Diesel guy.
I installed a LPLP on the 12V on my Gauntlet RC project.
I checked the fuel pressure on it the first time I fired it up. I seem to remember 14 PSI or so is what I got.
I am off to the shop to have a beer and swap in a fresh fuel filter in Poncho as it was faintly stumbling under WOT on the last drive. I will check back in later...
Some people here mention getting a spring from Fastenal that worked on the cheap. Or I have seen them offered from the Hungry Diesel guy.
I installed a LPLP on the 12V on my Gauntlet RC project.
I checked the fuel pressure on it the first time I fired it up. I seem to remember 14 PSI or so is what I got.
I am off to the shop to have a beer and swap in a fresh fuel filter in Poncho as it was faintly stumbling under WOT on the last drive. I will check back in later...
10-09-2017, 06:24 PM
#11
Registered User
Thread Starter
I was thinking you might have "upgraded" your LP a while ago, but couldn't remember...
You need to make sure you get a low pressure LP not just a stock 2nd gen one as it will run a pressure with is high enough your front seal on the VE is in jeopardy.
I got a fuel pressure port, basically a Schrader valve, from Geno's installed on my 12Vs and a temporary fuel pressure gauge that I can check any of my trucks if I suspect problems.
The fuel pressure port replaces the banjo bolt on the fuel line from the LP IIRC.
You need to make sure you get a low pressure LP not just a stock 2nd gen one as it will run a pressure with is high enough your front seal on the VE is in jeopardy.
I got a fuel pressure port, basically a Schrader valve, from Geno's installed on my 12Vs and a temporary fuel pressure gauge that I can check any of my trucks if I suspect problems.
The fuel pressure port replaces the banjo bolt on the fuel line from the LP IIRC.
I was told that it was the low pressure pump that I needed for the VE. Did I misunderstand? If that's the problem I can change a spring easy enough. Replacing the seal in the VE is a little more work but not something I haven't done before. The VE was a rebuild installed a little over a year ago.
Thanks for your help.
Edwin
10-09-2017, 06:39 PM
#12
Edwin, I'm sorry to hear on your troubles. So, here's what I know, not saying your situation is identical.
About the same exact time you were awaiting a new fuel line that accompanies that Amazon lift pump you had already installed, there was a member on here named JoelB that went thru your exact scenario. He was frustrated, very very frustrated, and had also bought a lift pump inexpensively from either eBay or Amazon. If you get your timelines organized and search up on the topics you had awaiting that line, you will see JoelB's posts. I also believe NascarMark had popped in and said to try and source pumps with a specific number series on them, as these were true Lehigh volume, low pressure quality pumps.
Now, what had happened thru a series of PM's between me and Joel, was that he ended up having his lift pump first looked at by a local Bosch diesel injection shop. There were certain innards in that cheap pump that failed. So, Joel goes on and buys the quality pump, from where I am unsure of.
Round two- after that lift pump swap, oil still in fuel. This time he takes the truck in and leaves it with that shop. Turns out it also was his pump seal. So he had two items fail, both being the sources where fuel enters and mixes with the oil. I'm hoping Joel will see this and pipe in, and possibly correct me if I have any explanation errors. I will PM him to have him offer his input.
Good luck with all that, Edwin.
About the same exact time you were awaiting a new fuel line that accompanies that Amazon lift pump you had already installed, there was a member on here named JoelB that went thru your exact scenario. He was frustrated, very very frustrated, and had also bought a lift pump inexpensively from either eBay or Amazon. If you get your timelines organized and search up on the topics you had awaiting that line, you will see JoelB's posts. I also believe NascarMark had popped in and said to try and source pumps with a specific number series on them, as these were true Lehigh volume, low pressure quality pumps.
Now, what had happened thru a series of PM's between me and Joel, was that he ended up having his lift pump first looked at by a local Bosch diesel injection shop. There were certain innards in that cheap pump that failed. So, Joel goes on and buys the quality pump, from where I am unsure of.
Round two- after that lift pump swap, oil still in fuel. This time he takes the truck in and leaves it with that shop. Turns out it also was his pump seal. So he had two items fail, both being the sources where fuel enters and mixes with the oil. I'm hoping Joel will see this and pipe in, and possibly correct me if I have any explanation errors. I will PM him to have him offer his input.
Good luck with all that, Edwin.
10-09-2017, 07:01 PM
#13
Registered User
Thread Starter
Edwin, I'm sorry to hear on your troubles. So, here's what I know, not saying your situation is identical.
About the same exact time you were awaiting a new fuel line that accompanies that Amazon lift pump you had already installed, there was a member on here named JoelB that went thru your exact scenario. He was frustrated, very very frustrated, and had also bought a lift pump inexpensively from either eBay or Amazon. If you get your timelines organized and search up on the topics you had awaiting that line, you will see JoelB's posts. I also believe NascarMark had popped in and said to try and source pumps with a specific number series on them, as these were true Lehigh volume, low pressure quality pumps.
Now, what had happened thru a series of PM's between me and Joel, was that he ended up having his lift pump first looked at by a local Bosch diesel injection shop. There were certain innards in that cheap pump that failed. So, Joel goes on and buys the quality pump, from where I am unsure of.
Round two- after that lift pump swap, oil still in fuel. This time he takes the truck in and leaves it with that shop. Turns out it also was his pump seal. So he had two items fail, both being the sources where fuel enters and mixes with the oil. I'm hoping Joel will see this and pipe in, and possibly correct me if I have any explanation errors. I will PM him to have him offer his input.
Good luck with all that, Edwin.
About the same exact time you were awaiting a new fuel line that accompanies that Amazon lift pump you had already installed, there was a member on here named JoelB that went thru your exact scenario. He was frustrated, very very frustrated, and had also bought a lift pump inexpensively from either eBay or Amazon. If you get your timelines organized and search up on the topics you had awaiting that line, you will see JoelB's posts. I also believe NascarMark had popped in and said to try and source pumps with a specific number series on them, as these were true Lehigh volume, low pressure quality pumps.
Now, what had happened thru a series of PM's between me and Joel, was that he ended up having his lift pump first looked at by a local Bosch diesel injection shop. There were certain innards in that cheap pump that failed. So, Joel goes on and buys the quality pump, from where I am unsure of.
Round two- after that lift pump swap, oil still in fuel. This time he takes the truck in and leaves it with that shop. Turns out it also was his pump seal. So he had two items fail, both being the sources where fuel enters and mixes with the oil. I'm hoping Joel will see this and pipe in, and possibly correct me if I have any explanation errors. I will PM him to have him offer his input.
Good luck with all that, Edwin.
https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...-93722/page10/
mknittle at Post #149 says the part number should be for the HVLP pump for the VE.
HOWEVER! My pump looks different from the the pump at this link: https://oregonfuelinjection.com/shop...ial/feed-pump/
I guess I'll have to start pulling things apart to figure out what failed. I think I can pull the lift pump and test it for pressure. Can the lift pump fail and dump a large volume of fuel into the crankcase? I know some diaphragm pumps I have looked at had a relief to allow fuel leaking through the diaphragm to just dump on the ground rather than into the crankcase but I don't know about the piston pump.
10-09-2017, 08:59 PM
#14
I didn't see the post from JoelB but I found the original thread I was going by:
https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...-93722/page10/
mknittle at Post #149 says the part number should be for the HVLP pump for the VE.
HOWEVER! My pump looks different from the the pump at this link: https://oregonfuelinjection.com/shop...ial/feed-pump/
I guess I'll have to start pulling things apart to figure out what failed. I think I can pull the lift pump and test it for pressure. Can the lift pump fail and dump a large volume of fuel into the crankcase? I know some diaphragm pumps I have looked at had a relief to allow fuel leaking through the diaphragm to just dump on the ground rather than into the crankcase but I don't know about the piston pump.
https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...-93722/page10/
mknittle at Post #149 says the part number should be for the HVLP pump for the VE.
HOWEVER! My pump looks different from the the pump at this link: https://oregonfuelinjection.com/shop...ial/feed-pump/
I guess I'll have to start pulling things apart to figure out what failed. I think I can pull the lift pump and test it for pressure. Can the lift pump fail and dump a large volume of fuel into the crankcase? I know some diaphragm pumps I have looked at had a relief to allow fuel leaking through the diaphragm to just dump on the ground rather than into the crankcase but I don't know about the piston pump.
Wish I would have wrote those series of numbers down. Maybe I'll see if NascarMark can reply to this tread, as he knows the numbers.
10-09-2017, 09:05 PM
#15
Edwin, go to page 4 of these treads, look up JoelB's tread on finding a chunk of metal in his oil. That was a part of his lift pump. I believe he tells which pump he bought on that tread. Your own piston LP tread should be close by.