RollsCoal

My Cummins Atlantic salesmen says there is no need for special diesel rated coolant to prevent cylinder liner pitting. He says the B series has no liners, so no need for, example ASTM 6210, heavy duty rated antifreeze.

I am confused. I have read it is important to run a heavy duty diesel rated coolant. I am in the early stage of researching what coolant I need. Help me out someone.

Ace

The salesman is correct. You can run just about any anti-freeze you want. Mopar's been using G-05 in the later models since around 2002 or thereabouts, IIRC. That's what I run in all our trucks and cars now.

infidel

All you need is low silicate coolant.
You would be hard pressed to find any coolant that isn't low silicate.
Your choice if long or normal life.

I use whatever is on sale at Napa, even the cheapo brands always say Cummins approved.

RollsCoal

I bought Peak Long Life. It says on their website it is phosphate and silicate free and that it meets ASTM D3306, and D4340. I read an article from the Turbo Diesel Register, that says I need low silicate coolant meeting ASTM 4985/GM 6038M.

I am probably over analyzing this, as I often do, but I would like to learn more about this. I am considering returning the Peak and buying coolant meeting ASTM D4985. What do you guys think?

I read so much conflicting info. I would like to flush the system with a good coolant flush, but some say that is not a good idea.

I plan to use distilled water when I fill up, but would like to flush it out with tap water. Some say not to even flush with tap water due to mineral deposits. I doubt this is something to be overly concerned with.

justme-

The astm 4985 is not as big a deal - google the astm numbers and you can read exactly what they mean. My understanding is if it meets D3306 and D4340 is has to meet D4985 to get there.

Personally I would not be worried about flushing with tap water, but then I would flush the tap out with distilled for the longest life and definitely use distilled for filling. Note, you may want to consider the state of your cooling system already- if the fins on your radiator are corroding off and you feel you might have to change it in the next year or 2, you might want to take that into consideration in the flushing now.

Unfortunately, while Cummins may approve a given coolant, that doesn't tell us what they approve it for. Most coolants are now low silica, but not all. just check to be sure, Peak LL is fine. Sillica deposits on the internals and caused build up, plus wear when it deposits around the water pump shaft and seal.

Midnite

Don't we need ethylene glycol based coolant instead of propylene glycol based coolant? I can't remember specifically why, but I could've sworn it was a bad thing to run the propylene glycol coolant.

Mike

justme-

Yes ethylene glycol based- which is 99% of coolants. Propylene has a whole list of short comings in coolants, but it is more environmentally and ingestion friendly.

http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/et...col-d_904.html

"Propylene glycols are most commonly used in applications in which low acute oral toxicity is required, or for freeze protection where incidental contact with drinking water is possible. In some areas, use of propylene glycols is required by local regulation. Propylene glycol-based fluids are used extensively in food processing applications, but ethylene glycol-based fluids can also be used in some instances."

guhfluh

If you are being so detail oriented about which coolant and filling with distilled water, then don't flush with tap water, as you will never get all of it out. You would have to pull out every block coolant drain there is and still have some trapped. It's just because you are being so analitical about it all. If you weren't worried as much I'd say go for it. I do.

RollsCoal

I returned the Peak Long Life, and picked up 4 gallons of fully formulated Peak Fleet Charge, from Tractor Supply. It has SCA's which are not necessary for our trucks, but I figured why not.

It was a toss up between using the final charge which is "fully formulated" with SCA's, and using the Zerex G-05 (hybrid organic additive technology, HOAT) which is used in 03 and newer trucks, and in using an ELC coolant which uses OAT, organic acid technology.

The TDR forum has an article which says all year makes of Dodge diesels should run the HOAT, G-05 coolant. It says it is back compatible with all models.

The extended life coolants are said to be a near lifetime coolant. It says you can run them up until 3 - 4 hundred k miles and then simply add an extender, which lets you run out to 600k miles.

Although I will never put that many miles on my truck, it would be nice to have a coolant which was that maintenance free.

Several companies make the ELC coolants, and I am wondering if anyone has experience with them?

Peak's version is called Final Charge:
http://www.finalcharge.com/program_overview.html

Ace

This is the same issue as the other "lifetime fill" lubes we've seen over the years. Syntorque and ATF+4 in certain applications comes to mind. The problem is defining "lifetime." To the manufacturer I believe it means the warranty period, which in the case of many consumers, may also mean the the same thing.

The G-05 extended service life coolant is rated by it's manufacturer at 5 years. It's good stuff and I'd have no problem pushing it a little longer in well-maintained vehicles with appropriate SCA's. I've got almost 4 years on the regular green fill in the 1st Gen right now, running SCA filters and it's fine. But I'm going to change it out sometime soon anyway.

What you can get away with in terms of service intervals is variable on how you do your maintenance. Manufacturer recommendation are general guidelines. Err on the conservative side if you're not sure about what you're doing. There's no substitute for good maintenance. Things like used oil analysis and just plain checking stuff on a regular basis are smart things to do.

guhfluh

If you do plan on running the coolant forever, I would look into a coolant filtration system just to be ultra safe.

justme-

good point raised- definition of lifetime varies based on the situation and the parties involved. Craftsman tools are the lifetime of the owner for example, but most auto part are only the lifetime of the part, which means when it wears out it's ended it's lifetime. I run the green stuff about 4-5 years with no problems.

BMW released one of their newer motorcycles with a sealed bevel drive- they said the lube was lifetime and thus it was sealed since servicing was unnecessary....until they found lifetime was not as long as they originally thought based on real world miles.

RollsCoal

I finally decided on running the Zerex G-05. I spoke with a Valvoline tech on the phone who had a lot of in depth knowledge on their products. I asked if I should run the G-05 or the Zerex Extended life. He said the G-05 offers the same cavitation protection as the ELC and is loaded with the necessary SCA's to protect a diesel engine. He said the ELC would offer the same protection, only at a greater cost ($18 per gal.) After purchasiing 4 gallons of the G-05 ($12 / gal.), I did notice it reads on the back of the bottle that it meets many diesel engine manufacturer requirements for coolant, including Cummins. According to DTR (DTR recommends it for all years of Cummins) it is back compatible to all years of Dodge with the cummins. Combined with the fact that Chrysler, and countless other oem's are using it, it seemed like a no brainer on going with the G-05.

I am also considering going with a coolant filter. Where is the best place to buy the shut off valves?

Is there any thing I need, other than:

Filter head
Filter
shut off valves
hose
clamps
npt barbed hose fittings?

Fueling around

Any brass ¼ turn ball valve will suffice. Make sure to use a zero unit (no SCA/DCA) water filter. Your Valvoline tech scares me. SCA/DCA are terms associated with conventional anti-freeze/coolants. OATS & HOATs use a listed "extender" that you add at the recommended interval.

gozapper

I had a 97 a while ago that had a hole between the oil valley and the water jacket. I have to believe it was caused by cavitation.
I have a 98 12 valve now. The local Cummins shop had an additive that they recommended to prevent the cavitation problems.
It can happen to any engine and when it does happen, there isn't any way to see where the hole might be.


Just my 2 cents worth.

Tom