zookeeper

Well the transmission in my 97 (12 valve) 4x4 is driving me nuts. The thing is such a slush-bucket... I am going to bite the bullet and have it rebuilt/replaced and am looking for some advice as I don't have unlimited funds.

The problem with the transmission is it never locks up unless I go into overdrive (around 50 mph) and when it does, if I put any sort of load on it (more fuel), it starts shuddering badly. If I am trying to pull a load, going through the gears (1 - 3) it seems like it is just constantly at 2000 to 2200 rpm and not pulling or engaging through any of the shift points firmly. I have started carrying a truck camper on the truck and want to pull my bike trailer behind and go anywhere in the country I want (flat land and mountains) without the worry of the transmission giving up.

That being said and reading through all the different posts here, I figure a rebuild or replacement is due - to include torque converter, flex plate and valve body at a minimum.

I am not against traveling a couple of hours to get what I need done but don't want to overspend or buy more than I really need. Does anyone know of a good transmission shop in the metro St Louis area - or within a couple of hours of St Louis?

If this was you - what would you do? A rebuild of the internals and torque converter replacmenet or a whole transmission swap to a DTT, ATS, Suncoast or Goerend? I don't need a competetion transmission but do need one that shifts smoothly and firmly - with a decent lock-up.

Your opinions are greatly appreciated.

infidel

If it was me I'd talk to http://www.goerend.com/ first

9812vram

I built my trans myself, it's the only way I'd do it. If you don't want to do it yourself, like infidel suggested, check with Goerends. That's a win win.

The shuddering is you're TQ slipping. It's toast.

The "slushy" part of these transmissions is ALL torque converter. In TQ terms, it's called "loose". I had a custom low stall single disk billet built for me at our local trans shop and it was still too loose. It was supposed to be a 1600 stall. I just took it out again two weeks ago and had them shave the stator down and tweak the fins so it stalls even lower. They said it should be 100-200rpm lower. Keep in mind that the Stall speed is almost irreverent. It's just that lowering the stall makes a tighter converter. It's so much nicer now. Never goes above 1500 rpm in town (unless I push it) and I never see 2000+ rpms any more unless I'm loaded and runnin' late, or driving really fast... Contrary to popular opinion, I have no issues with turbo lag either. Take that with a pinch of salt though - it does have to do with the way you drive and the power level of the truck. I'm not a grandpa driver but I don't run it like I stole it either and my truck is tuned up a wee bit. On a side note, make sure your trans oil pump is REALLY good or put in a new 48re pump. A worn 47re oil pump won't provide enough pressure to keep the clutches tight at low rpms and high load - due to leakage.

Late OD and TQ engaging can be fixed by tuning the TPS sensor voltage or adding manual switches. I had the same issue with my truck's TQ lockup but after I built my trans and added the ATS valve body and really low stall converter, the shift points all worked themselves out. I never need my manual switch anymore and I didn't have to dink around with the TPS voltage.
ATS valve body (search for 47re valvebody on eBay - got mine from user treasurevalleydiesel for about $500) makes nice firm shifts.

Check my sig for the general Mods I did to my truck and trans. Feel free to ask questions if you have any.

zookeeper

I am leaning towards Goerend and called them this morning (as well as a couple of other places). Very impressed and got a rough quote and timeline. If I did the whole transmission replacement - I have to wait till mid-February as they are swamped appearantly. This was a real good read - Thanks for posting Lost Lake:

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...ferrerid=26357

Transmission rebuilds are not my thing - tried rebuilding one myself 40 years ago on a Ford C6 out of a 65 Galaxy 500 (talk about heavy) in my parents driveway. My brother and I got it back in with no transmission jack, one trip around the block and the clutches were toast and the fluid was black. We then towed it to the junkyard after that. I know a lot of things have changed since I was a teenager but I remember how many parts I had spread across the garage floor, no special tools and not a clue.

Waiting isn't an issue as the truck runs OK now as long as I drive it with caution - plus it would give me time to save some more $$$. I sure wish they had a place close to St Louis that they authorized to do the work as they are 370 miles one way from the house.

Haven't finalized the decision yet so more thoughts are welcome.

9812vram

I completely understand your concerns about rebuilding it yourself. It's not for everybody.
You won't regret it if you do go with Goerends.
Good Luck!

Robert Rausch

ATS has a place in St. Louis who can install an ATS Stage IV. I've had my ATS since 2001, I've put over 175,000 miles on the truck since I got it, and it's never let me down once.

patdaly

Something to think about, Goerends is now selling everything to bring a trans up to their specs, and you can have a trusted local shop build it.

Saw it somewhere just this month.

zookeeper

@ patdaly - That option was given by Goerend as well and I am considering it too. That would make things happen quicker but I don't know if it would save any cash or which transmission shop is good in my area (Fairview Heights, IL or St Louis Metro).

patdaly

Well, they send the service manual as well, and considering Dave has spent many an hour on the phone with people who didn't end up buying from him, I would say any Trans. shop that can read or talk should be able to replicate his trans. You save the shipping costs, plus his labor, which can add up to a decent number.

Don't forget, these are basically 727 transmissions, just about the easiest tranny ever to work on.

9812vram

AMEN BROTHER!! That's no joke!

j-fox

I have fixed at least a dozen of these, just like yours.

Here are the issues.
first the converter is too soft/loose in stock form.
Second the trans/ valve body is too sloppy and low on pressures.
Third your motor could use a govenor spring kit to allow it to shift under boost at WOT, and run a little higher rpm when needed.
This makes a completely different truck.

9812vram

I keep running into this when researching gov springs. I don't understand it. Can you explain to me how a gov spring has anything to do with shifting? 47RE trans uses wheel speed, throttle valve input and TPS voltage (tps just for OD and TQ Lockup). Outside of the TPS there are no engine inputs. I wanna know how a gov spring makes the difference! My truck won't shift at WOT either - well it does, it just waits till Christmas and I want to tune that outa there! lol
Thanks in advance for the input...

j_martin

The only problem is that judging from his original post the TCC is toast at this point. Too late for stiffer shifting.

I'd bet the fluid's brown, doesn't smell quite right.

9812vram

Ya, too late for the current trans, but he did say:

Pretty much sums it up...

zookeeper

I have had the transmission serviced when I hit 120k and now have 160k on it. Fluid isn't brown or burnt but figure I could burn it up if I constantly pushed the pedal down, so I baby it currently and don't pull heavy loads.

I do have a 3 GSK and still find the transmission doesn't work as it is supposed to - shifts are VERY soft and only detectable by speed gained when running WOT. It really never "pulls" until the TC locks up in OD - otherwise, the RPM hits 25 - 28k until lock-up is achieved. 3GSK may work with a rebuild but was considering going to a 4GSK - figure I'd wait until after the transmission work to make that decision though.

Had one shop look at it and they said the TC and shift points needed work and a rebuild was probably warranted with a good transmission shop (they were not a transmission shop). So - that's where things are now - still trying to decide what to do...