What should i do to the 48re
07-22-2007, 11:47 PM
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What should i do to the 48re
Ok guys im tryin to get some info on tranny builds. I just installed a smarty and will be ordering 4inch dual exhaust soon. I wanna swap the TC for maybe the ats five star but what else should i do as far as billet shafts and the valve body. I dont plan on doing anything past getting the exhaust (famous last words) and its not gonna be doin power launches at the strip every weekend. Its an every day driver, so what do you guys think?
07-22-2007, 11:54 PM
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Welcome. All first post say "I'm doing this, and that, and that's it". Next thing you know, you're $6k in the hole and dyno'ing 600 hp. Search this board for GOEREND. I took this board's advice, and my Goerend tranny is awesome. Also, fill in your signature so we know what you're driving.
07-23-2007, 12:09 AM
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Yea no kidding, when i bought the truck i said i wasent eavin doin a programmer.......... o well, so how far should i go with the trans, as far as upgrades?
07-23-2007, 07:25 AM
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The tranny gurus like Georand will be able to answer the question the best, BUT I think the concenses is simply this: If you are going to pull out the tranny and put in a $1300 TC, $500 VB, $600 billet front shaft....you might as well do the rest because it's only gonna be another $1k if that. There are seals that need replacing, accumulator that needs to be upgraded, and the stock clutch packs.
To be realistic, I would say that if you aren't planning on beating the crap out of it, a billet front shaft wouldn't be necessary. I think that a good TC, VB, clutches etc.... are necessary. I've never agreed with the guys that just do a TC and valve body....there is a LOT more to an automatic tranny that just those two parts that increased HP will adversely affect. To be fair, I think the guys that are doing just the TC/VB aren't doing it to hold extra HP (at least I hope not). They are doing it for improved performance from the stock tranny. Changing out those two items makes the truck drive completely different. It would feel like a completely built tranny and it would deliver the power to the ground much more efficiently. BUT just replaceing those two items would not hold much extra HP overall. Obviously the TC increased lockup holds more power when you have the converter locked up but that's about it.
So....if you want a much better driving truck and you have more self restraint than anybody I've ever met a TC/VB would be fine. But if you actually plan on using that Smarty....you better talk to the tranny guys.
To be realistic, I would say that if you aren't planning on beating the crap out of it, a billet front shaft wouldn't be necessary. I think that a good TC, VB, clutches etc.... are necessary. I've never agreed with the guys that just do a TC and valve body....there is a LOT more to an automatic tranny that just those two parts that increased HP will adversely affect. To be fair, I think the guys that are doing just the TC/VB aren't doing it to hold extra HP (at least I hope not). They are doing it for improved performance from the stock tranny. Changing out those two items makes the truck drive completely different. It would feel like a completely built tranny and it would deliver the power to the ground much more efficiently. BUT just replaceing those two items would not hold much extra HP overall. Obviously the TC increased lockup holds more power when you have the converter locked up but that's about it.
So....if you want a much better driving truck and you have more self restraint than anybody I've ever met a TC/VB would be fine. But if you actually plan on using that Smarty....you better talk to the tranny guys.
07-23-2007, 06:49 PM
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I looked at the various options and wound up getting essentially what the low end Goerend tranny offers by a local shop. If I paid the local shop for the R&R and something went bad on it, I'd be out shipping and the labor to send it back to Iowa. For the price of the tranny and R&R labor, they did the same upgrades and gave me the same mileage warranty. The difference is they'll also cover the labor and there is no shipping involved, either for the original, or in case of failure down the road. Since I don't plan to do heavy towing, or put in any performance work, I think that tranny should like for a couple turns of the odometer.
07-23-2007, 09:41 PM
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Ok thanks guys. I think im goin to go to a local shop where a fellow member "Bigmac" just got his done. They warranty the work and do a great job. Ill go talk to them in a few days, are these input shafts known for breaking and what about the other 2?
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07-23-2007, 09:55 PM
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i would make sure that you change out the flex plate as well the stock one is pretty flimsy. call up Dusty at HTS he with be honest and straight forward with you about what you need. he knows his trannys to. i ahve to say i love my fully built billet HTS tranny.
07-23-2007, 11:15 PM
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I've got a Smarty, a four inch exhaust, over 100,000 miles and it's a daily driver too. I definately like the power and I tow, but I don't want to race it and I don't intend to break it.
Building the tranny seems like a bottomless pit but the practical things are simply a VB and TC. I also put in an intermediate band. The front shaft would be the next thing but should not be a problem at the 90 HP level, nor should the flex plate. Without modifications the first thing you'll see is a slipping TC while in lockup.
So if you really do plan to stay at or near this power level that is all you need. If you want a nice safety margin then go for the whole thing.
I am REALLY hoping I can slip in an Aisin one of these days. If a conversion kit becomes available I'll be right there to get it. No matter what you do to build a 48RE it still has only four, poorly spaced speeds and a clunky way of shifting. Chrysler has cut every corner they can get away with on the 48RE and now it takes thousands of dollars to make it hold up under power, using parts, in some cases from Chrysler, that should have been put in at the factory. What we need is a modern 6 speed auto instead of a 50 year old 3 speed with an add on OD. These trannys are fine for light duty use with stock power, but that's it. For towing and heavy loads they suck and for racing, they break. With modifications they won't break but they still suck for towing.
John
Building the tranny seems like a bottomless pit but the practical things are simply a VB and TC. I also put in an intermediate band. The front shaft would be the next thing but should not be a problem at the 90 HP level, nor should the flex plate. Without modifications the first thing you'll see is a slipping TC while in lockup.
So if you really do plan to stay at or near this power level that is all you need. If you want a nice safety margin then go for the whole thing.
I am REALLY hoping I can slip in an Aisin one of these days. If a conversion kit becomes available I'll be right there to get it. No matter what you do to build a 48RE it still has only four, poorly spaced speeds and a clunky way of shifting. Chrysler has cut every corner they can get away with on the 48RE and now it takes thousands of dollars to make it hold up under power, using parts, in some cases from Chrysler, that should have been put in at the factory. What we need is a modern 6 speed auto instead of a 50 year old 3 speed with an add on OD. These trannys are fine for light duty use with stock power, but that's it. For towing and heavy loads they suck and for racing, they break. With modifications they won't break but they still suck for towing.
John
07-24-2007, 06:02 AM
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I've got a Smarty, a four inch exhaust, over 100,000 miles and it's a daily driver too. I definately like the power and I tow, but I don't want to race it and I don't intend to break it.
Building the tranny seems like a bottomless pit but the practical things are simply a VB and TC. I also put in an intermediate band. The front shaft would be the next thing but should not be a problem at the 90 HP level, nor should the flex plate. Without modifications the first thing you'll see is a slipping TC while in lockup.
So if you really do plan to stay at or near this power level that is all you need. If you want a nice safety margin then go for the whole thing.
I am REALLY hoping I can slip in an Aisin one of these days. If a conversion kit becomes available I'll be right there to get it. No matter what you do to build a 48RE it still has only four, poorly spaced speeds and a clunky way of shifting. Chrysler has cut every corner they can get away with on the 48RE and now it takes thousands of dollars to make it hold up under power, using parts, in some cases from Chrysler, that should have been put in at the factory. What we need is a modern 6 speed auto instead of a 50 year old 3 speed with an add on OD. These trannys are fine for light duty use with stock power, but that's it. For towing and heavy loads they suck and for racing, they break. With modifications they won't break but they still suck for towing.
John
Building the tranny seems like a bottomless pit but the practical things are simply a VB and TC. I also put in an intermediate band. The front shaft would be the next thing but should not be a problem at the 90 HP level, nor should the flex plate. Without modifications the first thing you'll see is a slipping TC while in lockup.
So if you really do plan to stay at or near this power level that is all you need. If you want a nice safety margin then go for the whole thing.
I am REALLY hoping I can slip in an Aisin one of these days. If a conversion kit becomes available I'll be right there to get it. No matter what you do to build a 48RE it still has only four, poorly spaced speeds and a clunky way of shifting. Chrysler has cut every corner they can get away with on the 48RE and now it takes thousands of dollars to make it hold up under power, using parts, in some cases from Chrysler, that should have been put in at the factory. What we need is a modern 6 speed auto instead of a 50 year old 3 speed with an add on OD. These trannys are fine for light duty use with stock power, but that's it. For towing and heavy loads they suck and for racing, they break. With modifications they won't break but they still suck for towing.
John
Well said. I agree 110%.
07-24-2007, 02:34 PM
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The tranny gurus like Georand will be able to answer the question the best, BUT I think the concenses is simply this: If you are going to pull out the tranny and put in a $1300 TC, $500 VB, $600 billet front shaft....you might as well do the rest because it's only gonna be another $1k if that. There are seals that need replacing, accumulator that needs to be upgraded, and the stock clutch packs.
To be realistic, I would say that if you aren't planning on beating the crap out of it, a billet front shaft wouldn't be necessary. I think that a good TC, VB, clutches etc.... are necessary. I've never agreed with the guys that just do a TC and valve body....there is a LOT more to an automatic tranny that just those two parts that increased HP will adversely affect. To be fair, I think the guys that are doing just the TC/VB aren't doing it to hold extra HP (at least I hope not). They are doing it for improved performance from the stock tranny. Changing out those two items makes the truck drive completely different. It would feel like a completely built tranny and it would deliver the power to the ground much more efficiently. BUT just replaceing those two items would not hold much extra HP overall. Obviously the TC increased lockup holds more power when you have the converter locked up but that's about it.
So....if you want a much better driving truck and you have more self restraint than anybody I've ever met a TC/VB would be fine. But if you actually plan on using that Smarty....you better talk to the tranny guys.
To be realistic, I would say that if you aren't planning on beating the crap out of it, a billet front shaft wouldn't be necessary. I think that a good TC, VB, clutches etc.... are necessary. I've never agreed with the guys that just do a TC and valve body....there is a LOT more to an automatic tranny that just those two parts that increased HP will adversely affect. To be fair, I think the guys that are doing just the TC/VB aren't doing it to hold extra HP (at least I hope not). They are doing it for improved performance from the stock tranny. Changing out those two items makes the truck drive completely different. It would feel like a completely built tranny and it would deliver the power to the ground much more efficiently. BUT just replaceing those two items would not hold much extra HP overall. Obviously the TC increased lockup holds more power when you have the converter locked up but that's about it.
So....if you want a much better driving truck and you have more self restraint than anybody I've ever met a TC/VB would be fine. But if you actually plan on using that Smarty....you better talk to the tranny guys.
Yeah, yeah...we all know.
07-24-2007, 04:35 PM
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Have you actually spoken with Dave Goerend about your '06 tranny? He pretty much says the opposite of what you said here. Supposedly the 06's have very strong internals and can handle a lot of power. He told me I only needed about $80 worth of misc internal parts to handle 500hp.
Second of all I can only assume that you mean $80 in additional parts AFTER you spend nearly $2k on a TC and VB right? I don't think anyone (Dave included) would run 500 hp through a 48RE with a stock TC and VB. The line pressures are just too low, and the TC clutch won't hold that kind of power.
I guess my point is....you CAN get away with just doing the TC and VB IF and only IF you have relatively low miles and I still think the stock clutches would take an exception to being beaten like a rented mule witih 500 hp. Not to mention we are talking about an extremely complicated piece of harware that is the modern day slush box. One 48RE might run for 200k miles with little problem, and some (very few) have significant problems well before 100k miles. If you are gonna yank the tranny to put in a TC, why not make sure the rest of the unit is prepared for a beating?
Maybe this thread is more on the line of "what can I get away with", but then again, maybe it's about some peace of mind as well.
Third of all, I have no idea what upgrades were made to the 06 48RE compared to mine which is an 04, but 500 rwhp is gonna put you pretty close to 900 lb/ft of torque if not more....stock clutches won't last long under that butt whoopin.
Right off Dave's website...a good read...please note that this is a heavy duty tranny rated up to 400 hp. You'll notice also that it's $3200
http://www.goerend.com/transmissions.php
07-24-2007, 06:03 PM
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Well first of all you'll notice in my sig that I have an early 04...not an 06.
Second of all I can only assume that you mean $80 in additional parts AFTER you spend nearly $2k on a TC and VB right? I don't think anyone (Dave included) would run 500 hp through a 48RE with a stock TC and VB. The line pressures are just too low, and the TC clutch won't hold that kind of power.
I guess my point is....you CAN get away with just doing the TC and VB IF and only IF you have relatively low miles and I still think the stock clutches would take an exception to being beaten like a rented mule witih 500 hp. Not to mention we are talking about an extremely complicated piece of harware that is the modern day slush box. One 48RE might run for 200k miles with little problem, and some (very few) have significant problems well before 100k miles. If you are gonna yank the tranny to put in a TC, why not make sure the rest of the unit is prepared for a beating?
Maybe this thread is more on the line of "what can I get away with", but then again, maybe it's about some peace of mind as well.
Third of all, I have no idea what upgrades were made to the 06 48RE compared to mine which is an 04, but 500 rwhp is gonna put you pretty close to 900 lb/ft of torque if not more....stock clutches won't last long under that butt whoopin.
Right off Dave's website...a good read...please note that this is a heavy duty tranny rated up to 400 hp. You'll notice also that it's $3200
http://www.goerend.com/transmissions.php
Second of all I can only assume that you mean $80 in additional parts AFTER you spend nearly $2k on a TC and VB right? I don't think anyone (Dave included) would run 500 hp through a 48RE with a stock TC and VB. The line pressures are just too low, and the TC clutch won't hold that kind of power.
I guess my point is....you CAN get away with just doing the TC and VB IF and only IF you have relatively low miles and I still think the stock clutches would take an exception to being beaten like a rented mule witih 500 hp. Not to mention we are talking about an extremely complicated piece of harware that is the modern day slush box. One 48RE might run for 200k miles with little problem, and some (very few) have significant problems well before 100k miles. If you are gonna yank the tranny to put in a TC, why not make sure the rest of the unit is prepared for a beating?
Maybe this thread is more on the line of "what can I get away with", but then again, maybe it's about some peace of mind as well.
Third of all, I have no idea what upgrades were made to the 06 48RE compared to mine which is an 04, but 500 rwhp is gonna put you pretty close to 900 lb/ft of torque if not more....stock clutches won't last long under that butt whoopin.
Right off Dave's website...a good read...please note that this is a heavy duty tranny rated up to 400 hp. You'll notice also that it's $3200
http://www.goerend.com/transmissions.php
The misc stuff is in addition to the TC/VB/etc. As far as I know, that tranny on his site uses new stock clutches. He said they're good quality parts.
07-24-2007, 07:45 PM
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