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View Full Version : Has anyone tried a triple OD?


PapeCAT
11-10-2008, 06:55 PM
Hey all, I'm deciding which direction to go in my conversion for the w200 Crew cab. I am going to go ahead and stick the entire drivetrain from the '90 W250 in it which includes a Getrage 5sp, and a GV overdrive. The W200 already has a nicely installed 3 Spd Spicer aux trans (Over/direct/under). my original plan was to locate a donor and run the aux trans/brownie but the donor I found unexpectedly had a gv on it. What do you think? redundant overkill? The truck will have 4:10s. I am looking for streetability and ease of a lot of commuting 100 miles at a time empty most times, but definitely want the ability to two heavy. so lets see 3spd Aux X 5Sp Getrag =15 gears + GV splitter is what I'm looking at...

Alwaysworking
11-10-2008, 07:34 PM
i say go for it. may not beable to tripple overdrive much, but i think there are some roads you could get away with it.

and i haven't heard of any one else doing it

JLee
11-10-2008, 08:06 PM
I have a gear vendor on my Chevy, in fifth gear with the overdrive on I only ever shift out on a long hill. I would say the extra overdrive would be nice I have 4:10s with 35s. My motor is still 160 horse I have been running it for awhile to work the kinks out but Im planning on getting a set of 3:73s to get the rps down and stretch out a little on the road

PapeCAT
11-14-2008, 09:45 PM
Thanks for the input I am definitely going to go for it. I removed the trans/xfercase/GV today from the donor and will be doing a lot of work on it thru monday so we'll see....

bnold
11-14-2008, 10:15 PM
Sounds cool to me!

Alwaysworking
11-16-2008, 09:17 PM
what modle is the 3speed aux?

PapeCAT
11-16-2008, 09:36 PM
It is a spicer brown lipe 5831 or 7231 ,... don't know 4 sure yet

I don't know exactly what the model it is, I know the a b or c models have different od ratios. But it is a spicer...

Tate
11-16-2008, 10:16 PM
Whats the ratios of the OD's? I'm guessing triple OD's is gonna be way too much for driving unless you are on dead flat land all the time.

Alwaysworking
11-16-2008, 11:22 PM
will it take the power, the info i looked up on the 5831 says its only rated for 265lbs of tourqe

PapeCAT
11-16-2008, 11:54 PM
Yeah I found the same info, as well.

Looked up more pictures and found out that mine is actually the 7231D model.

The 5831 didn't look like mine at all. Mine is more square with the drain plug up a bit on the side, like the one in this pic from a recent ebay auction... looks like they don't go for much. sold for 112 dollars or something.... But anyway, I Think it will hold up behind the Cummins. But I think my data tag is long gone and these are the only pics I could find of the 7231D...

It is only a .86 OD. So I'll not have too much of an overkill triple OD setup. It will probably be perfect with the Getrag in 4th... TRIPLE OD will yield an overall 2.12 final drive. In 4th with the getrage and Over GV and Over 7231, it will yield a final drive of 2.72 which is still a lower overall gear than my d250 in 5th with 3.07s @ 2.37...

Direct Brownie and 5th Getrage + GV OD = 2.46

These larger 7231D brownies were installed in big rig dodge trucks (heavy and med duty) with Cummins and Detroit diesels in the 60's.

http://i9.ebayimg.com/02/i/001/0d/b1/9e4d_1.JPG


The other thing is, I found this printout too, and it lists torque ratings but if you read the top it is for the top mounted pto units for the brownie. I think that the numbering aka 5128 and 7128 means that the 5 series is rated for 500ft lbs and the 7 series is rated for 700 ft lbs.
http://webpages.charter.net/jlbarnes/diesel_stuff/auxboxes.bmp

wvopowered
11-23-2008, 12:05 PM
My only concern would be the parasitic loss of the added gears.I would run synthetic fluid for sure and the lightest wt you would feel safe with.If it was like the GV with a planetary set up it would not be as big of a loss.

grover
02-19-2009, 11:00 AM
did you ever go ahead with the triple overdrive. I am kinda interested in the outcome

77machomopar
03-08-2009, 10:55 AM
Bringing back a old post... How is this project turning out.

banks twinram
03-15-2009, 09:36 AM
i bet you could get up to about 175mph lined out!! go for it. if not, ill buy the gv from you, i now have a 1/2 ton with 2.73 rears and itll run 111, i have a brownie 3 speed to put in it, just havnt done it yet. and im looking for a gv to trip it. no telling how fast i go. i want to go to bonneville soon!!! that or i was thinging about turning the brownie around backwards so under was over!!! its like 2.5-1 o.d. 2nd gear on the highway! lol

PapeCAT
03-15-2009, 03:32 PM
I've not been able to work on the project since early JAN. Between travel for work and bad weather (truck is outside) the few weekends I've actually been home have been taken for other errands. I am considering the triple OD still but the Parasitic loss would definitely be there, the brownie box is a standard non planetary gear box unit.

I have installed the Cummins/Getrag/NP205/GV into the truck now, and looking at where it is sitting I will have some issues with the driveline if I wanted to keep the brownie box in there. The Yoke spacing between the GV and the Brownie is offset by a fairly large margin (GV output yoke is about 2" below the Brownie input yoke). The only thing I can see doing to line it up is to lower the brownie a small amount which may be possible but it hangs pretty darn low as it is. I am hoping to have this rig on the road before June so stay tuned. Any input is welcomed. I will try to snap some pics off next chance I get, which won't be for another weekend or two.

At least my schedule is freeing up from travel now.....

JLee
04-02-2009, 09:16 PM
I Just got back to having some free time and checked up on this post. I was hoping to see you had every thing going. I thought I would offer a little bit of input on the length of all that under your truck. I have had some time to drive mine a little more, that drive line is short on mine and I think I am already on my way to having u Joint issues.The 1350 off the back of the gear vendors will get hot some times not real hot but noticeable. I cheated the angle on the motor all the way back to give me just a little more of a angle on the drive line but I still may be a bit steep, If I am it is not by much just throwing that out there good luck

PapeCAT
05-26-2009, 02:41 AM
Hi Jlee,

I actually was able to do some work on the crew cab today. I am still considering the triple OD. The problem I was facing was that the GV yoke was about 1-2" BELOW the input of the brownie, and the spacing is very short.

However, doing some measurements today on the 1990 W250 (drivetrain donor) I noticed that the crew cab frame is about 2" taller/deeper than the W250 frame, setting the xmember lower... Which could explain why the whole asy / engine seems like it is a little tipped back. I am going to ask around but I think I'm going to have to embark unto the booty fab for the first time with a custom xmember. I could possibly use some sort of a spacer on top of the existing member and fab up the braces that mate up to it and the top of the frame. We shall see.

Not to worry though, the problem mainly was that I couldn't get any weekends freed up to go up the hill and work on the thing, but I'm in the process of moving the whole project to my shop in my backyard at my new house. This will allow the progress to move faster!

Thank you for everyone who has been following the thread. I will aim to make the thread more interesting with pics and updates. I can also take pics and answer any questions you may have about a crew cab swap or OD units and the brownie box.

One thing I need to do is order a new drain plug from GV... [duhhh]

JLee
08-09-2009, 12:26 AM
had any luck on your triple od papecat? I am dying to know how it drives hope you are having some good luck

PapeCAT
08-13-2009, 04:55 AM
Jlee unfortunately I abandoned ship. I found and bought a 1993 W250 that set me back and I had it all for sale for a good while, ended up parting the entire W250 donor GV and all other drivetrain parts...

simplicity's sake and cuz no one wanted to take over my project, I gave it another stab and I've got a 1991.0 Cummins and 727 in there now, the cool thing is is that it mounts in the stock smallblock/727 location with stock crossmembers! This means no changes and I can keep the brownie shift setup how it is... I've got it all bolted in now and am going to get it on the road soon... the 727 and 4:10s aren't going to run out too well on their own but the brownie will help, and I've got 5 37" hmmwv military tires mounted up to the 16.5 alloys that came on teh truck...

I scored a '76 adventurer D100 that had 60K original miles and the sheetmetal is amazing! Short bed, front clip and doors are going on the crew.. I'll get pics tomorrow.

The triple OD would've been cool but way overkill and the parasitic drag would've been a killer... Still would've been interesting keeping track of all the different gear selections...

JLee
08-15-2009, 08:56 PM
Sounds like you have been busy that 727 setup sounds intresting. That help keep your forearms from looking like popeye's! Hope it works well

PapeCAT
08-20-2009, 04:07 AM
The latest is the cummins is in the truck... need to replace a rear cab mount and config pwr steering, brakes, and fuel...

Rebuilt the whole front end with 1992 pieces... front and engine xmembers, front spring eyelets... (beefier than the 1972 ones that were CRACKED)

Added a 6th leaf to the stock military wrap packs on there.. looks slightly positive with all drivetrain installed...

Engine starts and runs though, good to go.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w183/papecat/P1000307.jpg

Green truck is front clip, doors and bed donor! ADventurer trim too!!!

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w183/papecat/P1000306.jpg

cLAYH
08-21-2009, 09:37 PM
Aww man! You're not really going to break up that '76 are you? Its a clean looking truck!

PapeCAT
09-14-2009, 12:20 PM
Yes it is a clean truck! It needs a pinion bearing in the rear axle though. And it needed to still be smogged in CA...

The 1976 bed, and front clip is going on the crew.

Everyone loves that clean little 1976 D100 Truck, not sure why haha...

The drivetrain will serve someone good as well, with a clean low miles engine and trans like that.

cLAYH
09-14-2009, 12:55 PM
I had a '73 Club Cab Short Box 4X4 in that same green with that same grill.

<sigh>

PapeCAT
09-14-2009, 03:25 PM
with the waffle grille? Or the quad kidney style grill laying on the grass?

PapeCAT
09-28-2009, 09:20 PM
Truck is sorta getting done... drove it yesterday and today... Not a resto, just an engine transplant, really.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w183/papecat/truck1.jpg?t=1254190617

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w183/papecat/truck2.jpg?t=1254190644

PapeCAT
10-03-2009, 11:02 PM
drove the truck a couple hundred miles today in the mountains to loon lake, it ran out great. In OD on the brownie with 4:10 and 37" hmmvw tires the speedo was reading 25 mph slow!!! wow... I think I need to get an alignment, it twitches and jerks when turning left... otherwise I was able to cruise at 70 all day long.. earplugs a must for long rides though at this point. I need to trim the fenders a bit more as well... flexed it out a bit much today and found that one out quick lol. pics and vids were taken if anyone is intersted.

JP-4.5
10-04-2009, 08:44 AM
Is that really how the mirrors mount? Looks crazy? I have never noticed them like that but will be looking around to see a older Dodge to compare with? My 2004.5 is the 1st Dodge truck for me so the older ones I know nothing about.

PapeCAT
10-04-2009, 12:34 PM
nah, they are installed incorrectly (intentionally) by the PO. They're designed to come straight out and the bar that the mirror sits on is supposed to be perpendicular to the ground. (huge towing mirrors) I don't know how they figured it out to install them this way but I have a pair of doors, front clip and bed from my 1976 adventurer that will be going on there soon.

perkins
11-16-2009, 12:02 PM
I had a 5831 spicer in my 75 Ford with a MT40 allison 6speed none OD the spicer rob's some power and never wouldn't stop leakingfor very long after putting new bearings and seals.A old mecanic that worked on these when they came out said the 5831 were very bad for leaking.I had a small air ram for shifting from Dir,to Od.and it was noisy also.
your truck look great doing a nice job.good luck with you build.

Dale

PapeCAT
12-05-2010, 01:04 AM
Just an update to the build -

Removed the brownie - So now only running Single OD in form of 5th Gear of the 2wd Getrag going into the Divorced Np205.

Have put thousands of miles on the setup - finished it up mostly last spring. Prefer driving it to my '93 for most uses. The '93 just rolled over 70K original miles and I only use it when going on road trip vacations really.

I've taken the Crew to Pismo - ran out well and never got stuck! The wheels are now steel BUDD wheels - 6.75" wide X 16.5".

One of the Aluminum rims developed a crack on my way up to humbolt area for camping last memorial day weekend.

I have been contemplating getting beadlocks so I can air down more but they seem to do fine with ~ 20 PSI for off road and good contact patch.

Also took the rig snow wheeling last week. It made it about as far as my buddie's Jeep on 34" tires aired down to 2 PSI so I did pretty well in this heavy beast.

Heater works

Carpet in

Electrical Bugs worked out

Looking for a nicer Bed and some nice front fenders - ended up offing the green truck all together because of bondo issues and rust. (!!)

Jeep stuck going up a hill - couldn't make it past that point and had to turn back.

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z283/catrav/jeep/DSC02128.jpg

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z283/catrav/jeep/DSC02099.jpg

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z283/catrav/jeep/DSC02095.jpg