James Lucas

Are the Big Three all running the same Fuel system now?<br><br>James

SjLingenfelter

Common fuel rail. Is that what your talking about?

James Lucas

I guess it would have to be...<br> Someone was saying that 6.0 Ford guys were bashing the Dmax and the 6.5 before that for the fuel system and what they didn't realize is it is now the same &quot;exact&quot; system used by the big 3.<br> Out of personal curiousity I just wanted to know if it was true.<br> Is it the same system? Same brand even? ???<br>James

Lil Dog

As far as I know the Fords are not common rail. They are still utilizing the HEUI injectors. Different system, sorta the same idea.<br><br>J-eh

James Lucas

I got this from Ford trucks .com<br><br>Hydraulic Rail Fuel Injection: Fuel injectors are actuated by a high-pressure hydraulic rail system that generates injection pressures up to 26,000 psi. The high-pressure fuel is quickly atomized as it is released into the combustion chamber, generating a clean and efficient combustion event. <br><br>Is that Common Fuel Rail renamed? Ok I am ignorant :-[

James Lucas

[quote author=JCL123 link=board=8;threadid=17474;start=0#163625 date=1059064336]<br>I guess it would have to be...<br> Someone was saying that 6.0 Ford guys were bashing the Dmax and the 6.5 before that for the fuel system and what they didn't realize is it is now the same &quot;exact&quot; system used by the big 3.<br> Out of personal curiousity I just wanted to know if it was true.<br> Is it the same system? Same brand even? ???<br>James<br>[/quote]<br><br>I don't mind if I was mis-informed I just don't want to stay that way <br>James

James Lucas

I think you are right about the injectors J-eh as the injectors are still WAY high dollar on those from what I hear.<br><br>James

SjLingenfelter

Thats Common rail.

Lil Dog

Not quite common rail ..

They (HEUI) don't have quite as high a rail pressure and the injector is its own &quot;injector pump&quot;.

The HEUI uses oil pressure (internal engine oil pressure) to drive the unit injector. Electronics pulse the oil valve in the injector and the injector has a plunger in it. This plunger will take the lower fuel pressure rail (don't quote me but around 50 Psi) and jack it up to the 26K Psi level.

The Bosch system maintains a higher rail pressure and only electronicly controls the fuel admission. Thusly the Bosch system can do the pilot injection (multi-pulse injection) to reduce noise and emmissions at low RPM. The HEUI system can't react that quickly..

FWIW the Dmax and the ECHO use the same fuel system, that is Bosch. However I believe that DMax may make their own injector specific to the 6.6L.

J-eh

me4osu

I'm no expert on the Furd system, but I think it takes some of the engine lube oil (after the pan pump and filter) and boosts the pressure in a secondary pump to roughly 500 psig. That is the pressure that the intensifier spool sees.<br><br>Below is a link to the intro manual to the 6.0l Powerjoke. I'm sure Ford will get it pulled from the net, when they find out it is there. Copyright laws and that kind of stuff....<br>http://www.backglass.org/duncan/ps60_manual/<br>

Lil Dog

Thanks for the clarification...<br><br>I was aware of a secondary pump, but not the fuel pressure level as from the tank its only 15 psi. There is also higher oil pressure in the PSD to run the HEUI system. The HEUI's use a &quot;common rail&quot; engine oil pressure line as well as fuel.<br><br>There was a high performance mod to run a jumper oil line at the rear of the heads from one bank to the other for the engine oil rails to eliminate the infamous &quot;cackle&quot;. So far it seems to work..<br><br>J-eh

James Lucas

Thanks for all the good info...<br><br>So it is the Cummins HO and the DMAX that share the Same Bosch &quot;common rail&quot; system...<br><br>And is that the same system that was used in the 6.5 turbo by Chevy?<br><br>James

Don M

The Common Rail technology is newer to us in the USA. <br><br>The old 6.5 Chevy was not CR.<br><br>The Dodge and Chevy Duramax use Common Rail. They even use the same pump. All Bosch parts for both. Both use a VCO type nozzle. <br><br>The 6.0 Ford is not Common Rail. It is hydraulic The 6.0 Ford injectors are made by Siemens and the first release is proving to have a some bugs. A newer design is complete I believe and being distributed. <br><br>Starting in 1998.5 ( 1997 for California trucks )the Ford system did use a split shot injection. Two shots of fuel per combustion cycle. <br><br>The Duramax and the Dodge use 2 shots per cycle as well.<br><br>Bosch still wins as always, but we dont get any other brands in the US i.e., like the Fiats use. Better yet even..<br><br>Don~ <br><br><br><br><br>

James Lucas

Thanks for the info....<br><br> I think Ford is replacing Injectors but not in sets but one at a time right now... : I could be wrong but that's how I understand it. <br><br> So it looks like the Dmax guys and the Cummins HO guys are going to mutually benefit from the bombing when it comes to the Bosch stuff now ???<br><br>James

Lil Dog

Yup, they both are going to have essentially the same sort of upgrades as far as electronics for the engine anyway. The Cummins clan get to benefit from all the destruction of the first runs on the upgrades for the DMAX... <br><br>Also as a note, the DMAX uses 2 injection pulses per cycle up to 2500 RPM, then it switches back to single shot injection. Its a sort of weird sound as you rev up, sounds like Dmax up to 2500 then when it switches, it sounds kinda like a Powerstroke, especially loaded...<br><br><br>J-eh