DieselScout88

alright i am a newby and i was wanting to buy a diesel but im not sure what year to buy. I will be daily driving it and doing some modifications. Ive been searching on the forums and still dont know what to think. i like the 24v because of the newer interior and updated look, and the six speed is also a good trans., but with the fuel lift pump and the vp44 fuel pump it would have to be upgraded as soon as i would buy one. What is the fass setup i hear about and how much will it cost. With that said two of my friends have 12v and say that its the way to go for cheap performance and reliability. Ive just heard that with that extra valve per cylinder that the 24v have if you upgrade the fuel system they can get really mean. Sorry the topic is so vast but I feel like im in the information overload zone and just wanted an experienced opinion besides my two buddies who say go 12v or go home.
Thanks for the help

jthorpe

Moving this to the General Diesel forum for now, where it should get more hits.

jwb600

94-98 12v you can do alot to. these trucks can build big power. the 24v 98.5-02 are good trucks just have pump issues like you already know. the problem exists with the 53 block also. there was an awesome thread on here with about thelve pages of info on this topic. buy an 02 to sum it up if you want a 24v. they are the best year & have the strongest block. I would get an ho 6 spd not a 5spd. thats my input

Box5

For reliability, the 12v. For power, either gets the job done. I say just go test drive a couple of both and whichever feels best to you get it, the vp44 seems like a real headache though. Not knowing when its gonna go, and small things like not running ur tank near empty or the pump will loose pressure and die. Grab urself a 98 12v and it'll have the new interior but still have the 12v with no computor stuff to mess up.

clutch1

depends what you want to do, if you like cheap power and thats the main reason for your truck get the 12valve, if you like adjustability in cab, tinkering with boxes, while rolling through traffic, a little quieter cab, and an engine that will respond better to towing with some mods, get the 24valve without the HO if you like more power, with it if your going light

John_P

DieselScout:

Welcome to the website!

The members here are giving you some good advice. I have owned both a 2002 Dodge CTD 24 valve (which I sold) and my 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve.
IMO, the old Cummins 5.9 12 valve engines are ALOT more reliable than the 98.5-2002 Cummins 24 valve engines with that very pesky VP-44 fuel pump!
I had to put two (2) of them on my 2002 in 94,000 miles! The P-7100 fuel pump on the Cummins 12 valve engine is TOUGH and very reliable! They are cooled by diesel fuel AND engine oil versus just fuel with the VP-44. Also, the fuel lift pump on the 12 valve engine is mechanical and anyone will tell you the lift pumps on the 24 valves have a very high failure rate.

I know there are members that have had good luck with the 24 valve VP engines but IMO they are few and far between. My choice would be to get a truck with the Cummins 12 valve engine.

Anyway, welcome aboard and good luck to you on your choice!

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John_P

DieselScout88

John thanks for the advice, i know the 24v has the fuel issues and i was wandering whats up with this "F.A.S.S." fuel system guys are using. If i were to put that fuel system on, with the extra valves per cylinder the motor has would it make more power than a 12v with equivalent mods. I just like the interior update alot more than the 12v. and i like the 6 speed tranny. I would like to go pretty rowdy with the motor on either kind of truck i get. Basically which one has the most potential.

thanks alot

displacedtexan

There aren't really "equivalent mods" the 12v is mechanical and the 24v is electronic. The 12v has the most potential, but the 24 is capable of well over 800hp.

Who has the highest hp 24? I know there are at least a few over 900, has anyone cracked 1k yet?

displacedtexan

Also FWIW, there are no new parts being made for the 6 speed in the 24v trucks, and the ones out there are getting more expensive. And the 5 speed shifts faster.

John_P

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DieselScout:

You are very welcome on the advice.

DieselScout,.......F.A.S.S. stands for "Fuel/Air Separator System" and these fuel pumps are built by "Diesel Performance Products" in Missouri. They build both the large F.A.S.S. Fuel System Pumps which includes the attached two fuel filters as well as just the F.A.S.S. Fuel Pumps with no filters. They also have different flow rates (GPH) for each individual's needs. Here is a link to their website for you so you can go over there and browse and read about the pumps: www.DieselPP.com.

IMO, if you buy a Dodge CTD 24 valve engine with the VP-44 you will be somewhat limited on H.P. due the the limiting capabilities of that VP fuel pump. The P-7100 Fuel Pumps can flow alot more fuel than a VP-44 and there are some on sled pulling trucks that are over 1,000cc's! Almost all of the DHRA Pro-Street Drag Trucks and the top DHRA Dodge CTD Trucks are running the Cummins 12 valve engine with the P-7100 Fuel Pumps.

A newly released very high flow VP-44 has come out and some of the members have reported good H.P./TQ. gains with these new pumps but as of yet reliability is a question as they are pretty new.

You mentioned that you liked the interior better on the later Dodge CTD 24 valve trucks versus that on the older 94'-98.5' Dodge CTD 12 valve trucks.
I don't know if you know this or not, but the later 98.5 Dodge CTD 12 valve trucks did have the newer style dashboards which were almost identical to the later 24 valve Dodge trucks. They are hard to find though.

You asked about power comparisons between the VP-44 24 valve Cummins Engines and the older Cummins 12 valve engines. As I said above, the newly released high flow pumps should get the numbers up some, but prior to the release of this pump, I saw very few 98.5-2002 Dodge CTD 24 valve trucks with VP-44 pumps that could get much above 650-700 H.P. on just #2 diesel.
IMHO, the Dodge CTD Trucks with the Cummins 12 valve engines can get way above that on just #2 diesel and I am evidence of that as my 1996 Dodge CTD has run a best dyno run of 809 H.P./1414 TQ. Now granted, my engine is "built to the hilt", but there are some guys across the U.S. that are way above me with the Cummins 12 valve. One guy who comes to mind and whom I highly respect is Richard Madsen who goes by MADDOG on most of the diesel websites, including this one. Richard has an older model Ford PSD Crew Cab, 4X4, Auto which he installed a twin turbo Cummins 12 valve in and that truck has hit close to or above 1,000 H.P.!! They call his truck the "FUMMINS!"

Anyway,......I hope this helps you some. Hopefully some of the other DTR members will get in here to give you some more input and info!

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John_P

John_P

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displacedtexan:

Are those 24 valve trucks you mentioned (800-900 HP) VP equipped trucks or 24 valve engines that have had a P-Pump installed on them?? I know that Doug Smith (Jetpilot) hit 912 H.P. with his 24 valve, but that number was with NOS also.

Thanks.

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John_P

displacedtexan

Not to pick John, you know a lot more than I do, but usually 98.5 refers to the 24v, and 98 to a 12v

VP, with drugs, I was thinking of Doug's and was also thinking that Rip Rook had built a VP truck to the high 800s, with NOS. 800 hasn't been done without drugs on a 24v, has it?

John_P

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Your right about those years on the trucks, DP, I don't know what I was thinking! DOH!! Sorry about that! Getting old......................

No, I don't think anyone has done over 800 on a VP truck without drugs. I think that DTR Member "c-hawk" was close though. Doug said he ran about 630 H.P. on fuel and 832 H.P. with NOS on that 2002 he had. His 912 H.P. number on our website records was with his 2001 Dodge CTD 24 valve which had a P-Pump conversion.

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John_P